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Inspector POLO  
#1 Posted : 14 October 2016 21:06:22(UTC)
Rank: New forum user
Inspector POLO

On a recent visit to the local indoor soft play centre I was assisting my daughter (this is allowed) up some of the soft play large steps (step is just under 1 meter or there abouts in height), so that she could gain access to the slide. Unfortuantly I lost my footing on the step and my shin came in to contact with the edge of the step at a 45 degree angle. To my suprise the padding was only on the top and side and if (like i found) you land / fall on the edge of the step at a 45 degree angle the platform would be exposed (2inch plate). I suffered a minor gash (bloody) to my shin.

I complained to the centre who advise that they have had a ROSPA inpspection 18mths ago which did not highlight any concerns. I proceed to contact ROSPA to get a copy of the report, however, they declined the request as it was confidential even though the centre proudly displays the ROSPA certificate at reception which states on the certificate for copies contact ROSPA!! ROSPA are going to change the wording as a result to all their issued certificates.

I also found that the manufaturers (national supplier) conduct regular inspections of their equipment.

I contacted the EHO who visited the site and found no concerns with the 'guarding / inadequate padding' of the steps, I explained that it could have easily been a childs head that came into contact with the step and for the sake of £20-30 additional padding could prevent a serious injury.

The BS on play equipment (EN1176 and EN1177 and Play England guide do not specificaly highlight the use of padding to steps.

Reserach (good old google) highlights accidents to chidren on steps has occured throught the UK within soft play centres - although not many cases. 

My questions to my fellow peers:

- Any ideas for a further course of action to make the company / manufacturers acknowledge there is a safety concern.

- Any suggestions on a course of action to proceed further with EHO's findings (i did escalate to the manager who stated that the inspector has 14years experience and is competent in such mattes so no further action would be taken - I am still waiting for them to put this in writing (4 months and numerous calls / promises and still waiting for an offical lettter stating no further action is required).

- Should the BS be amended to allow for padded steps etc where there is a risk of injury forseeable.

- Should the equipmet be inspected by an impartial party and not the manufacture of the equipment?

Any thoughts / suggestions / experiences welcomed.

 

 

  

hilary  
#2 Posted : 17 October 2016 09:09:13(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
hilary

I think you are on a hiding to nothing with this.  Unfortunately no matter how careful we are, accidents still happen and there are always hazards where the risk is considered "acceptable" for the general use. 

It sounds like the play area have implemented all the required measures to make this safe.  The manufacturer has a reputation so it is in his interests to ensure that everything is properly installed and maintained.  ROSPA also have their own reputation to maintain so it is not in their interests to cover up failings.  You have quoted two British Standards, neither of which have this as a requirement.

You can certainly contact British Standards and make a comment but other than this I do not think you have much recourse in law.

A Kurdziel  
#3 Posted : 17 October 2016 09:38:19(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
A Kurdziel

I agree with Hilary. This is where you come up against ‘reasonably practicable’. The steps have been checked by external professional auditors (Local Authority and RoSPA) and have passed both inspections. They comply with all available guidance and the relevant British Standard. Most people would say that the operator had done everything reasonable to manage this risk balancing the cost and expense (not to mention practicality) against the risk (A gash on your knee is unpleasant but it is not on the scale of things that serious). If wish to pursue any sort of action against the operator or the manufacturer of the slide, I think will have difficulty getting anywhere.  Contrary to what the Daily Wail says, the courts do not like to push the boundaries what reasonably practical and would be unlikely to recognise a claim.

grim72  
#4 Posted : 17 October 2016 09:44:59(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
grim72

Yup, I'm with Hilary on this one. Seems to me that the company in question have done everything reasonably practicable to ensure safety. Sometimes accidents do happen and this just seems like one of those occasions. I don't see any reason to take this further. Yes we all want to work towards zero harm etc but at the end of the day where do you stop? We'd end up walking around in padded suits, just in case we trip or fall. It's unfortunate you received an injury but at the end of the day I think it should just be put down to a life lesson and put it behind you. Probably not what you hoped to hear and others may disagree but simply my own personal point of view.

Invictus  
#5 Posted : 17 October 2016 09:48:23(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Invictus

If it is deemed safe, then either allow people to enjoy it or don't take your child there. Why do H&S bod's think they have a right to reports etc. No wonder people look at us in a bad light it's getting to the point that I tell people I'm a prison warden because I get less negative reaction than if I say I am in H&S.

firesafety101  
#6 Posted : 17 October 2016 09:56:35(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
firesafety101

I have lots of experience of soft play areas, having had 4 children plus a step son. I do love them and have been inside many assisting/playing with my kids. I do know how dangerous they can be, it's like being inside a cage full of wild animals who are out of control. So much fun. However, you say the step is 1 metre ??? Is that high, wide or deep. I think your problem will be you were an adult inside an area built for children. There will be an age/height limit which you will no doubt be way over. You research suggests there have not been many accidents in such areas so all the risk assessments would no doubt result in 'low risk'. Your complaint may result in adults being disallowed from entering such areas in future and a rule that children may only enter if they are capable of playing without direct adult supervision. I suggest if you really wish to push this arrange a half hour free consultation with a Solicitor. There are many who may be happy to take it on as a No Win No Fee case although I doubt if any would because you were an adult in a children's play area. I do however admire your persistence and congratulate you in your efforts to get the area made 100% safe. Please let us know how you get on. Good luck.
Ian Bell2  
#7 Posted : 17 October 2016 10:11:57(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Ian Bell2

What a sterile world it would be if everything was '100% safe'.

I'm with the majority - don't see a claim here. Sounds like reasonably practicable has been achieved.

Where do you want to stop - do you want to claim for every minor cut/knock/bruise etc. It's life.

WatsonD  
#8 Posted : 17 October 2016 10:23:14(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
WatsonD

POLO, you said you welcome any thoughts:

From your post it looks like they have sufficient control measures in place. No offense, but I doubt any of the children using it would land as heavily as you did if they fell the same way.

Certainly nothing in your post to suggest that anything untoward actually caused you to trip other than "losing your own footing". No wet floors or loose materials, etc.

Don't go back there again by all means, but at the end-of-the-day you fell over and hurt your shin. Let it go - your energies are better used elsewhere.

Invictus  
#9 Posted : 17 October 2016 10:55:51(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Invictus

Originally Posted by: firesafety101 Go to Quoted Post
I have lots of experience of soft play areas, having had 4 children plus a step son. I do love them and have been inside many assisting/playing with my kids. I do know how dangerous they can be, it's like being inside a cage full of wild animals who are out of control. So much fun. However, you say the step is 1 metre ??? Is that high, wide or deep. I think your problem will be you were an adult inside an area built for children. There will be an age/height limit which you will no doubt be way over. You research suggests there have not been many accidents in such areas so all the risk assessments would no doubt result in 'low risk'. Your complaint may result in adults being disallowed from entering such areas in future and a rule that children may only enter if they are capable of playing without direct adult supervision. I suggest if you really wish to push this arrange a half hour free consultation with a Solicitor. There are many who may be happy to take it on as a No Win No Fee case although I doubt if any would because you were an adult in a children's play area. I do however admire your persistence and congratulate you in your efforts to get the area made 100% safe. Please let us know how you get on. Good luck.

What is he actually claiming for 'banging his shin', unfortunately this seems to be the answer by some posters on here. What ever happened to saying 'god that hurt' and getting on with it. It is no wonder that we are seen in a poor light 'or should we now sue because the lighting is poor.

Why not just say to the kids be careful and watch them enjoy themselves and if they do happen to get hurt, just say aah, kiss it better and get on with it.

I thought it was solicitors who were pressing for payoputs but it seems to be some of our own. The mind boggles that there is a claim because someone fell over his own feet and banged his shin.

What you need to do in my opinion is wrap up in cotton wool and stay in.

firesafety101  
#10 Posted : 18 October 2016 10:16:54(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
firesafety101

Invictus. I suggested the Solicitor option as a way of ending the topic. I doubt very much if there is a claim but the OP requested assistance and has tried all avenues without success. This would be the final act to play out (excuse the pun) and if the solicitor says no claim that's it. I have in the past made claims for compensation, also a discrimination claim on behalf of my daughter, (no money involved), and been successful with them all. This makes me think I was right to go down that road.
6foot4  
#11 Posted : 19 October 2016 08:31:42(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
6foot4

Originally Posted by: firesafety101 Go to Quoted Post
Invictus. I suggested the Solicitor option as a way of ending the topic. I doubt very much if there is a claim but the OP requested assistance and has tried all avenues without success. This would be the final act to play out (excuse the pun) and if the solicitor says no claim that's it. I have in the past made claims for compensation, also a discrimination claim on behalf of my daughter, (no money involved), and been successful with them all. This makes me think I was right to go down that road.

I'm not sure a succesful claim is neccessarily an indication of whether that was the right thing to do or not in the given circumstances - each case needs to be examined on it's merits and is reliant on the moral intregity of the claimant and what their conscience allows them to do.  Many companies or their insurance providers settle a claim because it is sometimes cheaper to do that then go through the litigation process and try to defend the claim.  This has possibly aided the proliferation of dubious claims and the so called "compensation culture" often supported by that lovely phrase "where there is blame, there is a claim".  This often means that from a legal point of view, a fair judgement regarding the situation is not actually made, leading the successful claimant to believe that their claim was indeed valid because they received a payout.

Sadly, this has a knock on effect for all, including those who claim unnecessarily, because ultimately the cost of these claims affects the price of goods or services we all pay for - insurance premiums go up etc.  It also affects those with genuine claims, as they might find themselves having to fight an organisation who has had enough of spurious claims and decides to fight the matter on principle, regardless of the resources they have to put into it.

I've personally had several accidents many years back that I have not initiated a claim for that were far more serious than that described in the OP.  I've been electrocuted by an unprotected electric fence whilst visiting a client's premises and hit on the head by a metal traffic boom barrier falling from it's full height  - both of which could have had fatal consequences. Luckily, I walked away from both with no long term damage.  Had I known then what I know now, I would have been able to make a claim for compensation.  Ultimately though I had no real need for that money due to the harm/potential harm I sufferred.  The best aim / recourse would have been to find a way to prevent reoccurance of what happened to me which could have had far more serious consequences.  On the other hand, it could be suggested that making a claim might have focused the minds of those in control of the premises where I was harmed.

Inspector POLO  
#12 Posted : 23 October 2016 23:41:38(UTC)
Rank: New forum user
Inspector POLO

Thanks for all the responses, my concern is that if a child were to be 'pushed' or fall onto the 'unprotected step edge' they would invetitably suffer a serious injury. Reserach has found this to be the case on  a number of reported incidents on soft play steps.

What I am suggesting is a £10 (if not less) covering to eliminate the risk is this not reasonable considering the possible outcome???

I'm not sure why the EHO have delayed in responding formally as to there investigations..but will chase for any answer.   

I will update once i have a response..

Inspector POLO  
#13 Posted : 23 October 2016 23:47:45(UTC)
Rank: New forum user
Inspector POLO

....in addition as the equipment is inspected by the manufacturers not an independent body...it's inevitable they would not find fault ...should this not be by an impartial body??

bob youel  
#14 Posted : 24 October 2016 07:33:12(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
bob youel

I watched an adult play in such an area last Saturday with their child - after taking particular notice I found that she** was leaving a wake of problems behind her as she was negatively affecting a lot of the equipment she used especially the slide which is designed for children   ***(because of her weight etc. Appropraite notices were displayed but she ignored them)

And noting that the average person these days appears to be very risk advese I advise that people step back and evaluate properly taking note of professionals then move on and do not play in such areas that have been designed for children and if still worried pay for a bit of extrea padding themselves

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