I would go the other 15 years ago most people used one in work now everyone and his dog has one so the management we do during working hours is no longer relavent as I know if I am on my lap top at home I lounge around, don't sit correctly etc. If I use the main one at the desk I will sit on anything that is available abd can still be on it for  afew hours. Infact at home I am like quite a few people and lose track of time

Certainly needs a good review to bring them up to date with the evolution of the equipment (Infotainment, Sat-Nav, laptop, tablet, PDA, phablet, colour monitors, wide screen, high refresh rate, flat panel and multiple displays), the software and working practices (smart phones & emails).

My first ever work station was a 4:3 ratio monochrome CRT display with Lotus 1 2 3 which had to be loaded every morning from 5 1/4" floppy disc.

There are definately more people in the workplace interfacing with display screen technology... whether these would all count as DSE users compared to the days of the electronic (not electric) typing pool I wait to be convinced.

How far would you take this practice what they preach? I think H&S professionals should leave it in the workplace, for me there is nothing more boring than some anarak spouting about H&S when your traying to do a job at home, otherwise you would have no life, I had to have someone removed from site the other day for being drunk in work if I practicd what I preached I would never get drunk. I think there is a reason it is called health and safety at work.

Next people will be saying mowing the garden in a pair of slippers is dangerous.

Originally Posted by: Invictus

Next people will be saying mowing the garden in a pair of slippers is dangerous.

More disguised marketing/sales ... Marks & Spencer.

Where is the original post ?

Invictus seems to be responding to a question that has not been asked !

Originally Posted by: Invictus

Originally Posted by: chris42

Where is the original post ?

Invictus seems to be responding to a question that has not been asked !

Chris it was there, Honest!

Stonecold asked it and deleted it by mistake after some had answered see topis 'lost topic'

Originally Posted by: chris42

Where is the original post ?

Invictus seems to be responding to a question that has not been asked !

..and? ;-)

I am prepared to stand corrected by stonecold but the OP referred to the berating the DSE regs normally get on this forum and questioned if they were still fit for purpose.

My opinion is they are long overdue a damned good overhaul - back when these came in I worked on a monchrome CRT 4:3 ratio display and had to load the operating system every morning.

Advances in technology - colour display, high refresh rate, wide screen, touch screen controls / laptop / tablet / PDA / phablet / smart phone and now watches weren't part of the original consideration.

Changes in working practice also need to be included - very few sit all day at a terminal typing so whilst there are more workers interfacing with technology the number of traditional DSE users has probably decreased.

Transfer the eye test paragraph across to PUWER and we could probably see the back of them altogether.

Edited by user 02 February 2017 10:45:42(UTC)  | Reason: typo

Originally Posted by: Invictus

Originally Posted by: chris42

Where is the original post ?

Invictus seems to be responding to a question that has not been asked !

Chris it was there, Honest!

I believe you, not even I think you have gone completely loopy :o)

I think the DSE regs, did what they needed to at the time. I think assessment of work stations would not have taken place without it. A workstation in a factory type environment yes, but I suspect many bosses would not have seen the concept of the office desk as a workstation under PUWER. I think without such a regulation people would be working from laptops all day without docking stations etc. Even now you go places and see poor chairs and desks etc.

Things like the eye test and glasses are in my opinion are little vaguer. If I needed a false leg to get about to do my job, I would not expect my employer to pay for it, so why would I expect glasses. Then on the other hand if I needed prescription safety glasses, why should I buy something required for safety to do my job.

Things like the eye test and glasses are in my opinion are little vaguer. If I needed a false leg to get about to do my job, I would not expect my employer to pay for it, so why would I expect glasses. Then on the other hand if I needed prescription safety glasses, why should I buy something required for safety to do my job.

I have three types of glasses.  I have varifocals which are mine, I buy these and I have a pair of reactives and a pair of plain because I have to wear them all the time.  I have prescription safety glasses because I'm required to go to the factory and the Company pays for these.  Then I have VDU glasses which the Company also pays for. 

Unfortunately I cannot wear my varifocals for long periods on the computer because I get neck ache.  The focal point for these for the VDUis to look through the bottom part of the lens rather than straight ahead which means the head is always tilted slightly backwards.  Eventually the neck aches so if I am working at the computer for a long period, I wear my VDU glasses.

At home I usually use my tablet which is on my lap and my varifocals are fine, but do use my computer for long periods very spasmodically and I have some reading glasses which are OK but I wouldn't want to use them day in/day out.  My work VDUglasses stay on my desk at work.

So, are different glasses required?  Yes, actually for some of us they are very much required.

Totally agree with Hilary regarding the glasses.

Work laptop on docking station is at a different focal length to a natural reading position.

At home with my personal laptop perched on my knees reading glasses do the job - come to work and the prescription for reading glasses is not suitable for the accuracy required in the task.

So, what is a 'natural' reading position? For the first half of my working life there were no Personal computers. I sat at a desk to read and write and used a draftsman's board for the big stuff.

I wouldn't think of holding a book up at arms length at eye level!

With the advent of flat screens, is the "natural" position for a screen not better down at the desk surface (with small angular adjustment)?

DSE Regs? Redundant IMO

Free Eyecare for Users? Ridiculous. There's no evidence of DSE use harming eyesight. Money would be better spent ensuring porfessional drivers can see properly. 

"Natural" is normally arms by side pivoted at the elbow with hands holding the material so in the region of 10" - 18" from the eyes (dependent upon forearm length).

Workstation screens are often 24" or more from the users eyes (obviously laptops dependent upon peripherals e.g. docking station / extra keyboard tend to be used much closer) in line with your arms length comment.

Agree that deterioration in eye sight would be impossible to directly attribute to DSE use. From personal experience though older slow refresh rate "flickering" monitors certainly contributed to eye strain and the resultant headache/migrane.

Whilst it may look cool in the MD's office or on the TV news I think protracted use of a desk level screen would result in more aches and strains in the neck and shoulders (as experienced in youth on the original table top video games seen in pubs, clubs and amusement arcades).

Given most employers apply CATNAP for DSE I don't think there would be any appetite to extend eyesight test & prescription provision in to other areas of work where visual acuity is required. I have often had the fight regarding prescription safety glasses with the bean counters.