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damianb  
#1 Posted : 22 February 2017 09:41:26(UTC)
Rank: New forum user
damianb

This is for pre-GCSE students (i.e. under 16) and the idea is strictly not to have them observing but to have them actively experiencing aspects of the repair process (under supervision) to assess whether they want to work in the industry and whether my client then  wishes to fund their apprenticeship.

Other than checking with the clients insurance Company, young persons risk assessment and suitable induction training is there anything else anyone would suggest I do? 

Are there any restrictions I need to consider? 

Any suggestions are welcome and thanks in advance. 

WatsonD  
#2 Posted : 22 February 2017 10:04:13(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
WatsonD

Damian,

There is extensive information on the HSE website about this, but I would say you have it correct. I don't know if this is relevent but I would only say that perhaps you keep them away from knives of any description.

More info here: http://www.hse.gov.uk/yo...erience/placeprovide.htm

thanks 2 users thanked WatsonD for this useful post.
watcher on 22/02/2017(UTC), Striker84 on 23/02/2017(UTC)
gerrysharpe  
#3 Posted : 22 February 2017 10:16:23(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
gerrysharpe

Under health and safety law, every employer must ensure, so far as reasonably practicable, the health and safety of all their employees, irrespective of age. As part of this, there are certain considerations that need to be made for young people.

This section outlines the requirements in the law. Putting the requirements into practice should be straightforward and in most cases an employer should already have the necessary risk management arrangements in place.

Following the guidance means those involved in employing young people for work or work experience will be doing what the law requires.

Definitions of young people and children by age:

  • A young person is anyone under 18 and
  • A child is anyone who has not yet reached the official minimum school leaving age (MSLA). Pupils will reach the MSLA in the school year in which they turn 16.

Under the Management of Health and Safety at Work Regulations 1999, an employer has a responsibility to ensure that young people employed by them are not exposed to risk due to:

  • lack of experience
  • being unaware of existing or potential risks and/or
  • lack of maturity

An employer must consider:

  • the layout of the workplace
  • the physical, biological and chemical agents they will be exposed to
  • how they will handle work equipment
  • how the work and processes are organised
  • the extent of health and safety training needed
  • risks from particular agents, processes and work

These considerations should be straightforward in a low-risk workplace, for example an office.

In higher- risk workplaces the risks are likely to be greater and will need more attention to ensure they’re properly controlled.

Employers need to consider whether the work the young person will do:

  • is beyond their physical or psychological capacity
    • This doesn’t have to be complicated, it could be as simple as checking a young person is capable of safely lifting weights and of remembering and following instructions.
  • involves harmful exposure to substances that are toxic, can cause cancer, can damage or harm an unborn child, or can chronically affect human health in any other way
    • Be aware of substances a young person might come into contact with in their work, consider exposure levels and ensure legal limits are met.
  • involves harmful exposure to radiation
    • Ensure a young person’s exposure to radiation is restricted and does not exceed the allowed dose limit.
  • involves risk of accidents that cannot reasonably be recognised or avoided by young people due to their insufficient attention to safety or lack of experience or training
    • A young person might be unfamiliar with ‘obvious’ risks. An employer should consider the need for tailored training/closer supervision.
  • has a risk to health from extreme cold, heat, noise or vibration
    • In most cases, young people will not be at any greater risk than adults and for workplaces that include these hazards it is likely there will already be control measures in place.

A child must never carry out such work involving these risks, whether they are permanently employed or under training such as work experience.

A young person, who is not a child, can carry out work involving these risks if:

  • the work is necessary for their training
  • the work is properly supervised by a competent person
  • the risks are reduced to the lowest level, so far as reasonably practicable.
thanks 1 user thanked gerrysharpe for this useful post.
Striker84 on 23/02/2017(UTC)
watcher  
#4 Posted : 22 February 2017 10:45:42(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
watcher

Great post from WatsonD.

It sounds to me that you have a good grasp of the risks and have identified the steps to take, with the risk assessment and induction training.

I would probably also formalise the supervision levels, and allocate specific people to have the supervisory responsbility.

I think it's great that kids are getting the opportunity - so much more refreshing than the ban-it-all mentality

elburt  
#5 Posted : 22 February 2017 10:48:17(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
elburt

Good source of information above, if they are associated with a college or school check that they don't have specific requirements, sometimes the school have a work experience expert that will come and have a look around and check the garage risk assessments and what supervision will be in place etc. a good idea is to go through do's and don'ts for the young person and then in agreement with the garage to pass on to their staff so they know exactly what they are allowed to get involved with.

El 

HSSnail  
#6 Posted : 22 February 2017 12:12:20(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
HSSnail

If they are under 16 they are a child not a young person. There are different rules about child employment (not applicable to work experiance) which you should be able to find on your Local Council Education Department Web site. These are not made under the Health and Safety at work etc Act so outside HSE/LA enforcement.

Im not clear why someone under 16 would be doing an apprenticship unless there is some special arrangement as to why they are not in full time education, so appologies if these do not apply.

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gerrysharpe on 22/02/2017(UTC)
fscott  
#7 Posted : 22 February 2017 16:17:04(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
fscott

Originally Posted by: Brian Hagyard Go to Quoted Post

Im not clear why someone under 16 would be doing an apprenticship unless there is some special arrangement as to why they are not in full time education, so appologies if these do not apply.

Brian I know in Scotland schools are becoming more involved in vocational and practical subjects and as an employer we had a 15 year old student on a one day per week work experience placement over 6 months on more than one occasion so this sort of arrangement is not impractical.  The nature of the placement must tie in with a subject that they are doing at school and they use the experience they gain in the workplace as part of the ongoing assessments.  Allows them to gain a better understanding of what the job is like and to decide if its what they really want to do.  Sadly in our case it didn't work out for either of the students we had on placement but if they were good and showed real passion for the job they may well have been offered a formal apprenticeship after completing their school exams.

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HSSnail on 23/02/2017(UTC)
damianb  
#8 Posted : 23 February 2017 10:00:32(UTC)
Rank: New forum user
damianb

Thanks for all the feedback. There are certinally some avenues for me to check out and explore further so thanks for the great advice/feedback. 

I am all for giving the kid a chance, so many of my clients are too quick to dismiss the idea unfortunatly. 

HSSnail  
#9 Posted : 23 February 2017 15:48:04(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
HSSnail

Thanks fscott

Its been some time since i worked with /advised anyone involved in child employment hence my comments. I know the education system is changing all the time. I suspect in the situation you describe this would be more like the work experiance situation than child employment where permits and specific restrictions apply.

pete48  
#10 Posted : 23 February 2017 16:48:20(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
pete48

Damian B. You have a pm.

Generally as long as the activity is part of a school led/managed 'work experience' programme then local bye laws are not relevant. (e.g. working hours and prohibited places etc) However, there would still be the sensible restrictions/controls that have been mentioned and you would ned to identify those as your YP assessment. Note all you are really doing is to add YP to the persons at risk in your existing RA records and identify the additional controls. 

Some programmes are called 'extended work placements' where a student will attend an employer one day or more each week throughout a complete term or even longer sometimes. What you describe sounds a bit like that or maybe it is a 'Young Appprentice' scheme--if they are still in existence.

Ron Hunter  
#11 Posted : 23 February 2017 17:07:29(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Ron Hunter

In my day, we were down t'pit at 12 and up chimneys at 7.

I know 4 Yorkshiremen who probably had it tougher........

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xe1a1wHxTyo

thanks 1 user thanked Ron Hunter for this useful post.
Andrew W Walker on 24/02/2017(UTC)
sappery760  
#12 Posted : 26 February 2017 07:51:50(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
sappery760

School leaving age and associated areas are always changing so U must keep up to date e.g. my grandson is 17 yet he does not leave 'school of some sort' until he is 18 and in all my years of dealing in education I have found that its very very rare that a carreers person has any real competence re the workplace nor risk assessments etc. and these days most such areas have been given over to private charities and are not part of the schools inhouse systems

Young people are far better than given credit for by the politicially correct bunch so lets give them a chance even though they cost employers

RayRapp  
#13 Posted : 28 February 2017 08:46:36(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
RayRapp

My first job experience whilst at school was working for a day in a local garage. An apprentice and I spent most of the day removing a radiator from a mini. The experience taught me a lot - never become a mechanic!

No RAs or anything else in place but amazingly I survived. 

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