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kmason83  
#1 Posted : 16 January 2018 12:07:25(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
kmason83

So in the fire supplement for this montsh IOSH mag is this scenario about what would you do and I reda this bit "One morning, the supervisor enters a small kitchen and finds an electrical fire in a microwave oven, which is not significant enough to activate the automatic sprinkler system overhead. He tries to fight the fire rather than activating the alarm. He closes the kitchen door to limit the smoke’s spread and uses an extinguisher to put out the flames. However, untrained in extinguisher use, he uses a CO2 extinguisher and, due to poor oxygen levels, he collapses on the floor, blocking the door." now I get the point it's trying to make about how things can spiral but I would have thought the Co2 wa sthe write one, that the one I would have picked up because the fire is in electrical equipment, sure I wouldn't have done it that exact same way and I would have raised the alarm first but would you be using foam? its a straight up choice between a blanket, foam or Co2 in most outfits so am I forgetting some training here? 

Spacedinvader  
#2 Posted : 16 January 2018 14:23:34(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Spacedinvader

CO2 is correct yes. A quick "honk" of it into the microwave oven would put it out (I've had one before). IMO They would need to dispense the entire extinguisher for the CO2 levels to be an issue...
RayRapp  
#3 Posted : 16 January 2018 15:51:27(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
RayRapp

Where extinguishers are provided staff should be trained in their use. That being the case,  part of the training includes not using CO2 extinguishers in a confiend space. Indeed, on the fire extinguisher it should state 'Do not use in a confined space'.

It could happen of course...unlikely me thinks.

 

thanks 1 user thanked RayRapp for this useful post.
jodieclark1510 on 17/01/2018(UTC)
firesafety101  
#4 Posted : 19 January 2018 13:39:47(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
firesafety101

My advice would be sound the fire alarm, call the FRS then isolate the mains power if possible, to stand in the doorway so the way out is to hand, use the extinguisher and if the fire still burns when the extinguisher is empty, very quick with CO2, get out.

If your scenario occurs the FRS may need to access via window, if there is one, by that time with todays reduced firefighters and appliances there may be a quickly developing fire involving timber units, towels and ceiling tiles etc. There could be a fatality, all down to a small fire in microwave incorrectly tackled. 

How tragic.

thanks 1 user thanked firesafety101 for this useful post.
johnc on 19/01/2018(UTC)
Kate  
#5 Posted : 23 January 2018 09:43:41(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Kate

If the fire is "in" the oven as stated I would turn the oven off, leave the door shut and wait for it to go out!

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A Kurdziel on 23/01/2018(UTC)
Messey  
#6 Posted : 23 January 2018 11:35:09(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Messey

Originally Posted by: Kate Go to Quoted Post

If the fire is "in" the oven as stated I would turn the oven off, leave the door shut and wait for it to go out!

With respect, I believe there is a huge difference to an 'overheated food' situation to which this approach may be acceptable, to a situation where the contents are alight. The OP refers to an 'electrical' fire, implying the components of the microwave are alight .

If the food involved in the fire , of course, it does depend on what is alight in the oven. But I totally disagree that this 'walk away & wait' is a suitable procedure for the discovery of any microwave fire.

Certain foodstuffs - even bread - can create significant flame and heat. Certainly enough to ignited the plastic components of the microwave. So waiting for it to go out and delaying any intervention/action would not be suitable & sufficent procedure in my opinion.

pl53  
#7 Posted : 23 January 2018 11:41:24(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
pl53

If you are in a room with a fire, don't close the door. What do you think would happen regardless of the type of extinguisher used?

A Kurdziel  
#8 Posted : 23 January 2018 12:35:11(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
A Kurdziel

The solution is simple: ban microwave ovens- just get the canteen to supply free food!

Kate  
#9 Posted : 24 January 2018 10:56:41(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Kate

OK I will explain my reasoning!  If a fire is contained within a closed fire-resistant box (such as a microwave) then the last thing you want to do is to open the door of this box as this will let fresh air in to sustain the fire, whereas if the door is left closed there is a fair chance it will burn itself out as the oxygen is consumed.  The CO2 extinguisher is useless if you don't open the door of the box, and another type of extinguisher would most likely be dangerous on an electrical appliance.  So I wouldn't use any extinguisher.  I would not leave (!), but would stand at the kitchen door and watch to see if it did or not.

If the fire is not contained "in" the microwave but has escaped its containment, then it's a different situation altogether.  If it has only just done so, then my inclination would be to use a fire blanket.  If it is well alight, my inclination would be to close the door on it (me being on the other side of the door) and call the fire brigade.

Now please do tell me if any of my reasoning is faulty!

RayRapp  
#10 Posted : 24 January 2018 12:07:18(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
RayRapp

Kate, sorry but I don't think your reasoning stands up to logic unless I have misread your thread.

Opening the microwave (or similar sized container) will make no difference because the air will be replenished anyway unless it is an air tight sealed unit - not normally the case with a microwave oven me thinks. I am willing to be corrected.     

Spacedinvader  
#11 Posted : 24 January 2018 12:17:19(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Spacedinvader

Originally Posted by: RayRapp Go to Quoted Post

Kate, sorry but I don't think your reasoning stands up to logic unless I have misread your thread.

Opening the microwave (or similar sized container) will make no difference because the air will be replenished anyway unless it is an air tight sealed unit - not normally the case with a microwave oven me thinks. I am willing to be corrected.     

Well I wouldn't want to heat even a cup of water in an air tight sealed unit!
A Kurdziel  
#12 Posted : 24 January 2018 13:00:23(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
A Kurdziel

Let’s be really pedantic.  There is no such thing as an electrical fire. Electricity does not burn. An object connected to the electrical supple can catch fire but that is something else. So what does the original question mean by an ‘electrical fire’. Does it means that one of the electrical components in the microwave has caught fire (perhaps it has overheated as someone has block the cooling exhaust vents), does it mean that the contents of the microwave have caught fire (the curry left on too long gone dry and ignited) or does it mean that the body of the microwave oven (the flammable plastic bits anyway) is actually on fire?

If it is just the contents then Kate’s approach of leaving it to burn itself out would probably work. On the other hand if the oven itself is on fire then other actions might be needed.  Once an oven is going, note burning plastic, toxic smoke etc is it really sensible to suggest that someone approaches such a mini-inferno to try to put it out with a CO2 extinguisher. Note CO2 does not cool or permanently snuff out a fire and if the fire is hot enough then it might relight. A fire blanket would be the better option, but you have to get close to use it and will a normal user be confident enough to do this or will they just chuck it in the general direction of the fire and hope for the best?

I’m not sure I this is the ‘right’ answer but Kate’s suggestion is probable the best real world response. 

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