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Green40245  
#1 Posted : 16 May 2018 11:59:55(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Green40245

Hi is there a technical data sheet for diesel exhaust emissions, i would like to know what comes out apart from Nox and particulate

Hsquared14  
#2 Posted : 16 May 2018 12:14:50(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Hsquared14

There you go its all there.  BUT remember the exact ratios will depend on the vehicle.

https://www.dieselnet.com/tech/emi_intro.php

Roundtuit  
#3 Posted : 16 May 2018 18:31:38(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Roundtuit

NO because diesel exhaust is not a supplied substance or mixture.

Diesel exhaust is the by-product of burning diesel in an engine.

This is why (construction bods) an SDS is NOT a COSHH sheet.

AS the method of converting diesel to energy, and the actual equipment used, and it's maintenance are all beyond the control of the diesel supplier no SDS could ever be prepared.

You may have "best fit" guestimates but consider if this is tax avoidance diesel there will be no consideration of the colour bleaching agent

To know needs accurate measurement of the source
thanks 1 user thanked Roundtuit for this useful post.
A Kurdziel on 18/05/2018(UTC)
A Kurdziel  
#4 Posted : 18 May 2018 10:04:23(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
A Kurdziel

As said there is no such thing as an SDS for  diesel exhaust but the HSE does provide guidance on what your exhaust MIGHT contain and how they MIGHT expect you to control  it based on YOUR risk assessment.   See Control of Diesel Engine Exhaust Emissions in the Workplace HSG187

(Third edition, published 2012)- http://www.hse.gov.uk/pUbns/priced/hsg187.pdf

Green40245  
#5 Posted : 18 May 2018 12:06:16(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Green40245

Im absolutely confident the controls in place are very effective, I was just thinking how might the COSHH assessment look, I believe the EU are pushing for a WEL soon, so I am trying to preempt the documentation side. I would imagine a wood dust assessment might be similiar.

A Kurdziel  
#6 Posted : 18 May 2018 12:47:39(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
A Kurdziel

Correction, the EU has already, introduced an ‘Indicative Occupational Exposure Limit Values’ (IOELVs) for diesel exhaust( actually the three main harmful substances in diesel fumes, CO, NOX and SO)  in January 2017- EU Directive 2017/164.

It needs to be transposed into UK law (as a WEL) by 21st August 2018 and of course as we are still in it (the EU),until March next year  we need to do this.

Edited by user 18 May 2018 12:51:32(UTC)  | Reason: Clarification

Green40245  
#7 Posted : 18 May 2018 15:02:30(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Green40245

Originally Posted by: A Kurdziel Go to Quoted Post

Correction, the EU has already, introduced an ‘Indicative Occupational Exposure Limit Values’ (IOELVs) for diesel exhaust( actually the three main harmful substances in diesel fumes, CO, NOX and SO)  in January 2017- EU Directive 2017/164.

It needs to be transposed into UK law (as a WEL) by 21st August 2018 and of course as we are still in it (the EU),until March next year  we need to do this.

It wasnt in the first batch, (it was omitted from the Jan 17 requirements) they only voted for it in March 2018 this year, hence my mentioning it now

Roundtuit  
#8 Posted : 19 May 2018 11:27:04(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Roundtuit

That will be very interesting to watch - with an EU exposure limit an SDS is required but in this case it refers to a post use rather than as supplied situation.

Some vehicles use additives to convert the exhaust gasses, other do not so the supply chain would still have problems documenting what would, could or should happen.
Kate  
#9 Posted : 20 May 2018 06:51:59(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Kate

Sds is surely only required for substances / preparations that are supplied.  Exhaust fumes are not supplied, but generated by the end-user, so I don't see how sds could be required.

Roundtuit  
#10 Posted : 20 May 2018 13:16:52(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Roundtuit

An SDS or more correctly an e-SDS (extended SDS covering Process and Sector Use) is meant to consider the harmful effects from use of the material - diesel is supplied with the main intended use to be converted to energy through combustion so it would not be unreasonable to expect that an e-SDS Section 8 would list main/known combustion products especially those with a Work Place Exposure Limit.

To date I have only seen Diesel SDS describing the supplied product and no e-SDS with any consideration of vehicle/engine type (generator, FLT, Car, Truck, boat...) nor additive systems.

IMHO any COSHH application would likely necessitate actual workplace emissions testing of the vehicle to determine the mg/m3 per 8 hours (along with air change calculations etc.) as current vehicle manufacturer data is based upon laboratory testing under ideal conditions and expressed as g/km rather than providing real world figures reflecting how the vehicle is actually operated. By example one FLT provider uses a VW car engine which they convert to run on LPG - the VW manufacturer type test emissions data would obviously not apply to the supplied vehicle.

If you are involved with underground tunneling or mining EU 2017/164 Article 6 gives an implementing period ending 21st August 2023 for the three gasses.

chris.packham  
#11 Posted : 21 May 2018 08:45:29(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
chris.packham

Doesn't this illustrate one important point that I find some tend not to recognise? It isn't what you purchase that is the potential hazard, but what you end up with when you use it. As paragrph 10 of the ACoP for COSHH states as a hazard for the risk assessment:

"Employers should regard a substance as hazardous to health if it is hazardous in the form in which it may occur in the work activity. A substance hazardous to health need not be just a chemical compound, it can also include mixtures of compounds, micro-organisms or natural materials, such as flour, stone or wood dust."

Depending on the way it is used a single chemical may represent different hazards for different tasks. So can you base your risk assessment on what is on the safety data sheet\/

Chris

thanks 1 user thanked chris.packham for this useful post.
A Kurdziel on 21/05/2018(UTC)
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