Rank: Forum user 
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Hello all, I'm looking to renew my lead auditor training before long, and so thought it reasonable to become more familiar with ISO 45001 in preparation. I notice it looks very similar to 14001 now in structure but clause 4 in both of them give me something I'm not sure I've seen or workerd with before. Trying to take a systematic approach, I like to demonstrate how I got somewhere, i.e. questino sets and proformas, guidance to take to workers to get their opinion or similar. However, these 4 elements have me a little stumped. I've created some questions, and some loosely aimed statements reflecting the requirements but in all honesty, I wouldn't pass myself on audit :) I'm trawling through resources online, including those links on this IOSH website from here in. Does anyone have any tips or resources they could point me in the direction of please? I've been known to not see the woods for the trees before and am aware sometimes being systematic and thorough can lose track of sensible risk management - as the description to this post elicits, it's experience you simply can't 'buy'. Thanks in advance to all who read and contribute.
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Rank: Super forum user 
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Clause 4 - To secure for the workers by hand or by brain the full fruits of their industry and the most equitable distribution thereof that may be possible upon the basis of the common ownership of the means of production, distribution and exchange, and the best obtainable system of popular administration and control of each industry or service Bit of nostalgia that. Anyway. Interms of 45001 - 4.1 Understanding the organisation and its context is all about what external and internal factors can affect the OHMS. External factors can include political climate, competitors, new innovations, processes, the attitudes of trade bodies, new legal requirements, new technologies. Internal factors could include corporate governance, CSR, changes in structure or ownership, policy changes, new processes or technologies, industrial relations, safety culture, contractual arrangements, working hours and practices. 4.2. Understanding the needs of workers and other interested parties - these can include owners or parent companies, regulatory bodies, supply chain, contractors, workers and their representatives, customers, local authorities, neighbours . - What do they expect from you and how are you going to ensure you meet those expectations. 4.3 - Determining th escope of the OHMS - What parts of the business are going to be covered by the OHMS and how 4.4 - OHMS - How are you going to do it.
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 1 user thanked pl53 for this useful post.
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Rank: Forum user
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Thanks, I don't have it to hand but there looks to be a lot of the appendix notes in there.
The diagram from page 10 (I do have my flip chart to hand, with marked up comparisons with HSG 65 on) doesn't include clause 4. When I read your comments, I'm reminded of the appendix and notes / statements I created off the back of them. Really does seem an uphill task to systematically address the suggested elements but hey, nothing was ever given right.
Thanks again
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Rank: Forum user
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And how worried should I be that the term Marxism appears in the first 2 of those 4 linked wiki pages? Dare I tread on to 3 and 4?
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Rank: Forum user
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Clause 4 is the same across all 3 of the major Standards from Quality to Environment to Health & Safety - it uses Annex SL. In essence its about understanding your business, the impacts to and from it in relation to internal and external sources. We conducted a SWOT analysis, involving all areas of the business at all levels within it to determine what was perceived or identified under each pertinent heading. This was then transposed to a PESTLE analysis, Political, Economic, Safety, Technological, Legal & Environment table, with all elements considered of the business, placed under an appropriate heading. So Brexit was identified - Political, but because of the legislation element, it is also repeated under Legal. The picture builds up and from this, you can identify the risks and opportunities from both sets of analysis. Make sure you have your policies (as required) too!! Annex SL is the aspect you need to get hold of to work across all the standards.
Good luck. Waz
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