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Stephenl1985  
#1 Posted : 16 October 2018 19:59:20(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Stephenl1985

Hi guys,

Hope you are all well.

I have come here to post before I hit google.  The topic is in relation to Fire Exit doors.  We are currently renovating an existing Factory to move into in the next few weeks hopefully.  We've decided that we need more space in the warehouse, therefore, the exterior wall will be extended, thus moving one of the fire doors with the exterior wall.  The problem then lies with the perimeter of the factory, which is bordered by a tall steel fence with spikes on top (not sure on the correct name). 

So, if you imagine a Fire Exit in the corner of a Warehouse, you leave via the door and you can not turn left due to a dead end, you can not move straight away from the building due to the fence, although, there is 1 meter, the only option is to walk along the perimeter (of the potentially on fire building).

I have suggested developing a relationship with the owner of the land beside us to put a gateway through the fence and to lead away from our building the quickest possible way.  This suggestion was not takin well due to poor relations and security issues but I will push on this matter!  

Can anyone suggest anything else we could do?  Am I right in thinking that building control will not allow this extension due to the location of the Fire Exit and fence?

Thank you for your time to read and reply.

Ian Bell2  
#2 Posted : 16 October 2018 21:36:32(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Ian Bell2

Seen lots of similar examples. It should be ok.

Only 2 questions, is there any exterior lighting along the escape route. Assume being on the 'backside of the warehouse its unlikely.

Also what is the ground? Just unmade ground/earth? Will be slippy etc after rain. Usually concrete paving flags are put down until made / good ground is reached.

Don't forget future maintenance - cut back any weeds/long grass along the escape route, the door open ok etc.

So long as it is possible to reach the designated fire assembly point etc, once out of the building the travel distance is quite large.

Stephenl1985  
#3 Posted : 16 October 2018 22:24:56(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Stephenl1985

Hi Ian,

At the moment there is on lighting on the exterior wall, but I have highlighted this to management.

The ground at the moment is uneven and broken, although, we will be reconstructing this part after we have installed a Geothermal heat pump.

I have read online, OSHA 1910.36(h)(4) The outdoor exit route must not have a dead-end that is longer than 20 feet (6.2 m).

I may need to go to the new site and take a measurement from the door to the nearest corner of the exterior wall.  I also forgot to mention there is cladding on the walls, am I correct in thinking they should be fire resistant up to 1 hour?

Ian Bell2  
#4 Posted : 16 October 2018 23:43:59(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Ian Bell2

Are you in the USA? Why are you quoting American guidance?

If you are in the UK, us UK guidance documents

Also the 'exit door route' is usually the distance inside the building. Once outside you are just about at a 'place of safety'

Messey  
#5 Posted : 17 October 2018 21:29:39(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Messey

Walking along the perimeter may well be acceptable, but I would argue that even more important than the external lighting is risk assessing any openings in the building’s wall. I assume eventually the route leads away from the building and not an enclosed courtyard as this would not be acceptable

You have not mentioned the travel distance that evacuees will have to walk close to the building. Taking into account the 1000mm width of the route, I would not automatically assume it to be a place of safety. 

You are saying those using this route will be within 500mm or so of the building, so if they pass any windows or openings, it is important that any fire in the building does not effect or block the external route. 

Fixed non fire resisting glazing may be required if there is a high fire landing in the building that opens onto the windows in question, or if a rapid fire spread is likely. The speed that any fire will be detected will also influence the suitability of any openings.

firesafety101  
#6 Posted : 18 October 2018 11:06:17(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
firesafety101

Hi Stephen, you don't say if you have a fire risk assessment that should be revised and updated when there are any alterations to be made, and after.

Have you identified the hazards, people at risk, removed or reduced the fire hazards, reduce the risks to people, etc.  You are thinking the right way by asking this question.

Fire exits are important and it is not as simple as keeping the same exit but moving it to another location, that needs to be assessed to see if the exit is still relevant.

Have you thought of putting a new fire exit elsewhere, maybe the opposite side of the building perhaps.

Without seeing the building we can only guess but the opinions you have already are all good ones.

Connor35037  
#7 Posted : 18 October 2018 15:18:02(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Connor35037

One thing to consider is whether you need to pass any "higher-risk" areas such as boiler/plant rooms as you make your way along the building perimeter to the assembly point.

If not it should be ok but otherwise it would be down to a dynamic risk assessment at the time.

nic168  
#8 Posted : 24 October 2018 14:26:26(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
nic168

 How many people would have to exit through this path- which is effectivly a narrow corridor?

From your description I think I have seen similar set ups on warehouses where there ahev been very few people actully based so that over crowding and funnelling are not an issue, that said 1 m wide is quite narrow, particularly if there are fence posts, gutters, pipes etc intruding into the space.

kmorrow87  
#9 Posted : 29 October 2018 10:05:25(UTC)
Rank: New forum user
kmorrow87

I was just wondering if anyone could provide some clarity on training requirements for fire extinguishers

I work for a local governemnt body, all dept supervisors are fire marshal trained, but we have drivers who have small extinguishers in their cabs to aid escape in the event of a fire, they are not fire marshals therefore what levels of training is required to use the small extinguishers? 

Could the qualified fire marshals provide training?

Thanks

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