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dennispollard  
#1 Posted : 07 November 2019 09:51:50(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
dennispollard

One slide one it states

The new confined space schedules guidance tool has been uploaded onto OWOW in place of EHS 012-F01.

Why? What was wrong with the previous one?

  1. It states that someone with a level 5 city and guild (6150-61) appointed person must have written the RAMS and likewise a Level 5 AP must review the RAMS.

Level 5 deemed to be over and above current requirements – detailed in guidance

I have tried to research this guidance and I couldn’t find not anything and the guidance is not the law. To me this is saying that a level 5 AP is overkill and since when do you need a diploma level 5 to write the RAMS?

But the client is insisting that I need a level 5 in confined Space to write the RAMS.

The type of Confined Space that we are working on is classed as a medium risk and my staff are trained for Entry into Confined Spaces with Escape Breathing Apparatus, is this adequate?

Roundtuit  
#2 Posted : 07 November 2019 10:14:15(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Roundtuit

Lots of acronyms OWOW, EHS 012-F01 regardless of which client's job = client's rules

If you are already working this implies you are under contract with your existing arrangements.

Change of rules = change of contract = negotiation

stevedm  
#3 Posted : 07 November 2019 12:30:17(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
stevedm

Guess the client is trying to just say you need to prove competence to that standard to be able to do this task...I can say that I pretty much agree with them...unless you can prove competence another way then CG 6150-61 applies, which is about Managing confined spaces...I am sure there will be some flexibility, however you need to show you meet that criteria...just saying its over the top will not get you through this...and to be honest in my experience the contractors that have shouted loudest have not been the ones most qualified to carry out the job...I don't mean to be harsh but your client does seem to know the risks in confined spaces...the training you describe for entrants is fine (so long as they are in date) but you need someone who is qualified to manage confined spaces... 

thanks 1 user thanked stevedm for this useful post.
mihai_qa on 07/11/2019(UTC)
dennispollard  
#4 Posted : 07 November 2019 16:38:44(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
dennispollard

Originally Posted by: stevedm Go to Quoted Post

Guess the client is trying to just say you need to prove competence to that standard to be able to do this task...I can say that I pretty much agree with them...unless you can prove competence another way then CG 6150-61 applies, which is about Managing confined spaces...I am sure there will be some flexibility, however you need to show you meet that criteria...just saying its over the top will not get you through this...and to be honest in my experience the contractors that have shouted loudest have not been the ones most qualified to carry out the job...I don't mean to be harsh but your client does seem to know the risks in confined spaces...the training you describe for entrants is fine (so long as they are in date) but you need someone who is qualified to manage confined spaces... 

Hi Steve, I am just trying to find out if this is the law or is it their company policy. I do not know what you mean by shouting the loudest, I am just trying for get more information on this. I have been the Client and Principle Contractor on more occasions than I have been the Contractor and from my experience the Client is not always right. 

Edited by user 08 November 2019 08:35:02(UTC)  | Reason: to make sense

Roundtuit  
#5 Posted : 07 November 2019 20:59:03(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Roundtuit

The Confined Space Regulations appeared in 1997 as S.I. 1713.

The only change showing on OPSI is as a result of The Diving at Work Regulations S.I. 1997 No. 2776.

There are NO pending changes listed for the legislation.

https://www.hse.gov.uk/confinedspace/ 

L101 is third edition published December 2014

INDG258 rev 1 was published 2013

Draw your own conclusion from the above if the "law" has changed

dennispollard  
#6 Posted : 08 November 2019 08:33:26(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
dennispollard

Originally Posted by: Roundtuit Go to Quoted Post

The Confined Space Regulations appeared in 1997 as S.I. 1713.

The only change showing on OPSI is as a result of The Diving at Work Regulations S.I. 1997 No. 2776.

There are NO pending changes listed for the legislation.

https://www.hse.gov.uk/confinedspace/ 

L101 is third edition published December 2014

INDG258 rev 1 was published 2013

Draw your own conclusion from the above if the "law" has changed

Hi,

Thank you for clarifying this, I was under the same conclusion as i could not find anythng anywhere. I could not find anything on OSOS apart from on Confined Space training websites. If the Client required this training then we will have to increase the qoate. 

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