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Tittensor26376  
#1 Posted : 15 September 2021 11:54:52(UTC)
Rank: New forum user
Tittensor26376

HI,

We put our supervisors and managers through SSSTS and SMSTS in order for them to gain supervision and management skills to manage our activities on site.

we also have put them through level 6 NVQ's in construction management.

It has been suggested that if they have the NVQ level 6 do they need the SSSTS or SMSTS??

I cans ee the logic behind this, any input appreciated.

Al

yulkok  
#2 Posted : 15 September 2021 13:40:12(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
yulkok

SSSTS and SMSTS are often a standard requirement on construction sites particularly those associated with companies who are members of or who have adopted the Build UK training standard. NVQs are usually required for CSCS cards but not sure if a level 6 is accepted or not.

peter gotch  
#3 Posted : 16 September 2021 15:54:21(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
peter gotch

Hi Tittensor

The better part of the UK construction industry generally requires its managers and supervisors to get SMSTS or SSSTS (or some accepted equivalent) in addition to their other qualifications (or "grandfather rights").

SMSTS and SSSTS specifically focus on the health and safety elements of someone's role - which elements are not necessarily covered in the same depth as in e.g. a Level 6 NVQ in Construction Management.

So, as example, in simple terms when e.g. a major client is looking at bids by contractors for work they will be asking whether key people in the proposed team have BOTH the necessary discipline qualifications (+ sufficient, relevant experience) AND the industry standard H&S qualifications.

....and the bidders (from whatever geography - I've looked at numerous bids for work in the UK from contractors NOT based in the UK for UK) usually know this.

thanks 3 users thanked peter gotch for this useful post.
Tittensor26376 on 17/09/2021(UTC), Martin Fieldingt on 17/09/2021(UTC), R.Gav on 23/09/2021(UTC)
Tittensor26376  
#4 Posted : 17 September 2021 08:44:58(UTC)
Rank: New forum user
Tittensor26376

Thanks Peter, this has always been my understanding, the question came up recently on a site we are workig on whereby another sub contractors 'site manager' had advised one of ours that " he didnt need the SSSTS as he had his L6 NVQ and the maion contractor was OK with this"

As this was not my understanding, and I had heard no 'different on my usual sources', ive been 'putting it out there' to see if anything had changed with industry standards etc.

Thanks for your clear description, greatly appreciated feedback.

alan.

Originally Posted by: peter gotch Go to Quoted Post

Hi Tittensor

The better part of the UK construction industry generally requires its managers and supervisors to get SMSTS or SSSTS (or some accepted equivalent) in addition to their other qualifications (or "grandfather rights").

SMSTS and SSSTS specifically focus on the health and safety elements of someone's role - which elements are not necessarily covered in the same depth as in e.g. a Level 6 NVQ in Construction Management.

So, as example, in simple terms when e.g. a major client is looking at bids by contractors for work they will be asking whether key people in the proposed team have BOTH the necessary discipline qualifications (+ sufficient, relevant experience) AND the industry standard H&S qualifications.

....and the bidders (from whatever geography - I've looked at numerous bids for work in the UK from contractors NOT based in the UK for UK) usually know this.

thanks 1 user thanked Tittensor26376 for this useful post.
Martin Fieldingt on 17/09/2021(UTC)
peter gotch  
#5 Posted : 17 September 2021 14:25:20(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
peter gotch

Hi Alan 

Main (often being the Principal) Contractors and subbies have tried to find ways of bending the rules whether statutory or, in this case, industry agreed best practice for as long as I can remember! [which includes a 4 year stint in Construction from 1986-1990 when I worked for HSE].

Suppose as a Principal Contractor you pass the message down through the supply chain that the Client expects a two pronged approach to manager/supervisor competency and some site manager for the PC decides to turn a blind eye to that for their preferred subbie whose manager has a Level 6 Construction Management qualification but NOT the SMSTS/SSTSS to go with it and 

(a) either the Client does an audit

(b) or it all goes wrong and armed with the benefit of hindsight the investigators are doing a document trail

I can see where the focus could easily be!! 

Even though it is quite probable that the focus should mostly be somewhere else - particularly if the investigators should be looking for underlying conditions.

However, as soon as the Main Contractor's Contracts Manager or Site Agent bends the rules for one subbie, you might as well rip up the rules.

Now if that Contracts Manager/Site Agent has documented that the subbie can demonstrate something equivalent to the industry standard H&S ticket, then fine.

Simples!

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