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kpain  
#1 Posted : 28 February 2024 11:03:41(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
kpain

We have a flammable storage room classified as an ATEX Zone 2, the room being explosion resistant, 60 minute fire rated doors and walls, and natural ventilation. We discovered that there is a gap in the wall near the ceiling to allow some pipework to pass into the next room and have been deliberating the right way to go about sealing it.

The initial suggestion made by both an advisor and a previous safety rep is to fill the gap with a similarly rated fire resistant expanding foam, and I have seen some similar suggestions in the forums previously. My initial concerns with this is whether we would be able to apply such a foam internally, as it would likely be easy to apply the foam, however a little tougher to prove a level of competence to confirm that it has been applied in a way that would be compliant.

Because of this I have since reached out to an FSIDip qualified person who works in compliance, who has advised that the foam would not be compliant for the required kind of passive fire protection.

Would any others here be able to share there thoughts on this, and what should be deemed suitable to address the issue? Why would similarly rated foam be insufficient in such a circumstance? I presume i'm missing some particulars with DSEAR regulations or the Standards any kind of sealing products would need to conform to. I'm happy to take the advice I have been given however the powers that be are a little tougher to persuade when it comes to their money.

Thank's in advance!

antbruce001  
#2 Posted : 28 February 2024 12:08:03(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
antbruce001

This is not a DSEAR issue, it's a fire safety compartmentation issue.

You are quite correct in that you need to fire-stop the opening around the pipe to an appropriate standard. Your message suggests that 60 minutes fire protection is required.

In almost all cases, expanding foam (even when fire-rated) is not suitable for any effective level of fire stopping. Even when it is appropriate, it needs to be installed by a competent person and certified as adequate. You can't just pop down to the nearest DIY store and buy a tin to do it yourself.

You need to find a competent service provider who can determine the correct materials and method of application, install it and then certify its integrity. They will also be able to advise if pipework collars are required, as you didn't mention what type of pipework this relates to.

In this case, the only appropriate answer is; ask an expert!

Hope it helps,

Tony.

thanks 3 users thanked antbruce001 for this useful post.
kpain on 28/02/2024(UTC), Kate on 28/02/2024(UTC), peter gotch on 01/03/2024(UTC)
Roundtuit  
#3 Posted : 28 February 2024 12:29:23(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Roundtuit

Have to agree with Tony

The "foam" you refer to is normally associated with use around door and window frames to fill small gaps and the associated test report will contain a field of application describing amongst other things the dimensions of the void that may be filled along with any starting/finishing or covering materials to be used.

In the absence of harmonised standards some manufacturers voluntarily apply CE marking to products following European Technical Assessment methodology (ETA).

ETAG 026 part 2 covered penetration seals (now EAD 350454-00-1104)

ETAG 026 part 3 covered linear joint and gap seals (now EAD 350141-00-1106)

Fire Protective Board, slab and mat products and Kits is covered by EAD 350141-00-1106

In all cases the "performance" of the product is measured to EN standard - Fire resistance tests for service installations:

EN 1366-3 2021 Penetration seals

EN 1366-4 2021 Linear joint seals

EN 1366-5 2021 Service ducts and shafts

EN 1366-11 2018+A1:2021 Fire protective systems for cable systems and associated components

It is an area for a specialist to compare the "hole" you are seeking to fill against the necessary materials to suitably complete the task.

Do have to ask though why the void was not sealed at time of construction/installation?

This is the typical oversight in construction someone knocks through or builds around services and then leaves the designed compartment breached.

thanks 4 users thanked Roundtuit for this useful post.
kpain on 28/02/2024(UTC), peter gotch on 01/03/2024(UTC), kpain on 28/02/2024(UTC), peter gotch on 01/03/2024(UTC)
Roundtuit  
#4 Posted : 28 February 2024 12:29:23(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Roundtuit

Have to agree with Tony

The "foam" you refer to is normally associated with use around door and window frames to fill small gaps and the associated test report will contain a field of application describing amongst other things the dimensions of the void that may be filled along with any starting/finishing or covering materials to be used.

In the absence of harmonised standards some manufacturers voluntarily apply CE marking to products following European Technical Assessment methodology (ETA).

ETAG 026 part 2 covered penetration seals (now EAD 350454-00-1104)

ETAG 026 part 3 covered linear joint and gap seals (now EAD 350141-00-1106)

Fire Protective Board, slab and mat products and Kits is covered by EAD 350141-00-1106

In all cases the "performance" of the product is measured to EN standard - Fire resistance tests for service installations:

EN 1366-3 2021 Penetration seals

EN 1366-4 2021 Linear joint seals

EN 1366-5 2021 Service ducts and shafts

EN 1366-11 2018+A1:2021 Fire protective systems for cable systems and associated components

It is an area for a specialist to compare the "hole" you are seeking to fill against the necessary materials to suitably complete the task.

Do have to ask though why the void was not sealed at time of construction/installation?

This is the typical oversight in construction someone knocks through or builds around services and then leaves the designed compartment breached.

thanks 4 users thanked Roundtuit for this useful post.
kpain on 28/02/2024(UTC), peter gotch on 01/03/2024(UTC), kpain on 28/02/2024(UTC), peter gotch on 01/03/2024(UTC)
kpain  
#5 Posted : 28 February 2024 13:19:50(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
kpain

Thank you both for the quick and detailed responses!

I appreciate the clarification that this does not concern DSEAR directly, I may have been barking up the wrong tree. 60 Minute fire protection is required, I feel part of the difficulty I have been facing is the use of the term "competent". Myself, the previous safety rep, and management all regularly have clashing opinions on what constitutes competent, typically I will always lean towards asking a specialist whereas the alternative suggestions tend to lean towards the cheap and easy DIY option. In that respect, this kind of sanity check was much needed for my own sake.

As for why it was not sealed at the time of construction, I am still rather new to the company and i'm unsure, however I presume it was either missed (unlikely), or additional pipework was installed by a slightly less fire-safety conscious contractor for other purposes and the room not re-assessed after the fact. This is something I will need to enquire about further.

John Elder  
#6 Posted : 29 February 2024 16:53:27(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
John Elder

Kpain

I hope you are well.

Also bear in mind where you mentioned the in you post that the room is explosion resistant in case this is not actually the case.

Explosion resistant would indicate that the room is constructed in such a way as was as to either be structurally sound enough to contain the pressure generated from an explosion or it has explosion venting installed to allow the pressure to vent to a safe location.

If either concept was the case then the fire rated foam is not suitable as the room as first it may not contain the pressure buildup within the room and let the explosion travel to another part of the building, or the foam may give out before the explosion venting to a safe area can activate and allow the pressure into another part of the building.

I think you actually meant that the room was fire rated for 60 mins as opposed to explosion resistant and probably fitted out with ATEX rated equipment to remove electrical ignition sources.

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