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Posted By Rex Harrison
Can anyone clarify a point for me.
If a company vehicle driver was involved in an emergency, what responsibilities would he/she have to non-employees and/or employees if:-
a) the driver was a first aider,
b) the driver was not a first aider but had a first aid box?
In the majority of cases I find that vehicle drivers drive alone so I would expect the first scenario would be the most extensive.
Rex.
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Posted By Alan Johnson
Rex
I have replied to this to pull it back to the top of the forum as it is linked to a question I asked two days ago. I am hoping that it gets a response this time around.
Or if you received a direct reply, perhaps you could pass the information to me.
Alan.
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Posted By Ken Taylor
I fear that the question may not be sufficiently specific to obtain a complete answer. What is the driver driving? What's in the job description? Are there passengers? Are they employees? Is he appointed as a first-aider? Is another vehicle involved? Who is responsible for the accident? Is the driver in a condition to provide first-aid after the accident? Has the driver been given instruction in a procedure to follow in the event of an accident? Was the vehicle in proper condition? Did the driver check this? etc. If your question is about the difference in responsibility between an appointed first-aider driver and a non-appointed one, the earlier debate on this forum (and the former one) should help to some extent. Basically the driver has a duty to observe the law (both road traffic and health and safety at work) and a responsibility to perform the duties of the job as notified by the employer - which may, if in a position to do so, include the provision of first-aid to fellow employees and others in his/her care. That said, perhaps others will be in a better position to respond than me?
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Posted By Rex Harrison
Alan thanks for pulling this one up again I thought it had died.
I will email you my response from the HSE, although it just clarifies the meaning of certain terms and doesn't get to the nuts and bolts of what I was trying to ask. Maybe Ken is right, I'll rephrase my question to account for my specific circumstances, although I concur with your end statement. Ken what is the date of the previous thread you mentioned, thankyou.
In these scenario's our vehicles are regularly serviced, road worthy, contain first aid kits, the drivers of both vehicles are medically fit to drive, are not under the influence and are driving to the rules of the road.
Umm.. makes you wonder how an accident could happen doesnt it?
If one of our company vehicle drivers, (eg a Sales Rep) was driving a car, accompanied by two passengers, another employee (eg Technical Operative), and a customer, and was involved in an accident (eg. collided with another car on the public road, containing only a driver, - but neither party was wholly responsible) and all were injured to the same extent requiring urgent medical attention.
Except that in:-
scenario #1 The company driver (Sales Rep) was only was a first aider, and
scenario #2 The company driver (Sales Rep) was only slightly innjured and not a first aider but had access to a first aid box.
What responsibilities would the Driver have to the customer and the other employee in the company's car, and to the driver of the other vehicle in regards to providing assistance?
This question arose after I consulted the workforce on a revision to our first aid policy following risk assessment, proposing that all drivers should have First Aid Training, but some drivers have been less than keen, lets say in finding time to attend courses.
Rex.
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Posted By Alan Johnson
Rex
Your scenario 2 is very similar to what am looking at. I have a small road haulage company operator with twelve HGVs, all vehicles have first aid kits (although not very comprehensive)yet no one has had any training. The owner says it is not necessary as they (drivers) are either on their own or on a site where there should be first aid provision i.e. docks or factory premises. I am trying to get the owner to have all drivers trained to appointed person level and have tried to explain different situations where this would be necessary for example when drivers have returned to his yard and are injured whilst changing trailers etc.
At the very least the owner and one or two drivers are going to get some form of training, they just need a little more help in deciding that it is a good thing.
Alan.
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Posted By Jason Gould
excelent topic.
I would be careful in deciding the anwer as i think and am not quite sure that there are civil cases where people can be sued for giving first aid outside of the workplace etc. Remember reading this ages ago. Will look at a book on torts and recuers tonight and see if i can offer anything usefull tommorow.
Hpefully some smart chap or lady has already looked at this in the past and will enlighten us all.
Good luck
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Posted By Dave Wilson
Couple of points as I see it.
1. Employees who are HSE approved First Aiders are there to give First Aid whilst 'at work'.
2. Any employee as long as they are 'working inside the scope of their employment' are acting as an employee of the company and as such would be covered by EL Insurance so it is not really drivers responsibility but the employers to.
3. Can a person working alone be capable or even able to give first aid to themselves?
4. Why have a first aid kit available if the person is not trained to use it?
5. What is the frequency and likely hood that a lone driver would be required to administer first aid whilst at work and therefore do not use the skills at all apart from every 3 years when you requalify?
5. Moral dilema now! If you are first aid trained, do you stop at an accident and give a member of the public the benefit of your life saving skills or do you carry on? Are you not now working outside the scope of your employment if you stop?
Is there some sort of Road Traffic legislation that requires the carriage of 1st Aid kits on HGV's PSV's etc?
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Posted By Ken Taylor
See:
Liability of First Aiders (20.03.03);
First Aid to Non Employees (13.01.03);
First Aid Box Company Cars (13.03.02);
First Aid (27.11.00); and
check the search facility for the 'Old Forum'.
Unless the driver has been appointed by the employer to provide first-aid to others, any such service provision should be seen as an act of common humanity but will not be part of the driver's work or covered by employer's liability insurance. To respond to some other questions raised: some lone employees will be provided with a personal first-aid kit following assessment under the H&S(First-aid) Regs in order to provide first-aid to themselves; and some vehicles will be required to carry a first-aid kit (eg minibuses).
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