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Posted By Liam Mc Conalogue
Hi All,
I recently have had a query from a colleague of mine- he has encountered a bit of a problem with his managment(homeless resettlement project) with regards missing training.
For arguements sake- say that he worked Mon night and was expected by his manager to travel straight from his night shift to go to a one day H&S training and then back home for 3 hours sleep and then back to his Tues night work.
Can anyone out there assist with regards to which work laws that are being contravened here?
Thanks in advance.
Liam
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Posted By Kieran J Duignan
I believe that you should check the Working Time Regulations 1998, Liam, as they indicated the scope for flexibility
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Posted By Keith32
Regardless ot the specific laws - I would argue that this is simply unreasonable.
To work a night shift, then attend a day of safety training, a 3hr break and then another night shift....
Well you write the accident report and highlight the contributing factors.......
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Posted By Liam Mc Conalogue
This colleague works for a company outside of my control and has had his union rep in with him, and unfortunately has allowed my colleague to receive an official warning.
I have told him that he definitely has to appeal this, but his union do not appear to be sending competent reps to fight cases.
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Posted By Karen Todd
Doesn't it say in the Management Regs that training should take place in working hours?
Karen
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Posted By Liam Mc Conalogue
That is correct Karen- but as we know that doesn't be always the case. I don't even think my colleague would have minded attending outside of work hours if he had have been allowed to attend when he could have had night off before and after the 8 hour course.
But it is a point that I will pass onto him.
Liam
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Posted By Kieran J Duignan
Liam
Besides the legal perspective, there's an additional one that may be worth exploring rather than getting totally bogged down in what may well be management who are so incompetent they can't recognise it.
Spend a little time studying the course your friend 'should' have attended and work out a learning programme that you could take him through to cover the content.
This could be proposed as a 'face-saving' compromise, as long as any disciplinary action is withdrawn and without precedent for the future.
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Posted By Laurie
My interpretation is that training time is working time, and the normal continuous work hours/rest period limits apply.
Laurie
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Posted By Brett Rolls
Does it not clearly state in the working time regulations that an employee should recieve a minimum 11 hour rest period between shifts.
Sadly i too work for a company that disregard this set of directives on a regular basis.
Am i alone in believing that these regulations are under enforced and swept under the carpet on a regular basis?
Upper company management do not seem to recognise the link to accident statistics and fatigue.
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Posted By Kieran J Duignan
Liam
Reviewing this discussion in relation to your original question, I think that besides the WT Regs, it's also worth considering introducing the Management of Health and Safety at Work Regs 1999 on 2 scores
a. the responsibility of an employer to assess risks to an employee working with homeless people, when he may be coping with sleep deprivation
b. the responsibility of an employer to assess risks to an employee from stress arising from an invalid use of the disciplinary procedure and possible breach of the Employment Rights Act 1996 and the Employment Act 2002.
That said, the purpose of setting out the law should be simply to demonstrate a firm negotiating position from which the employee can gain a clean slate, and ideally the manager gets a 202 lesson in health and safety at work, free of charge.
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Posted By Liam Mc Conalogue
Certainly does seem to be the case in this situation Brett.
I have noticed this in the past with companies who want their personnel to attend training on a Saturday when they are only contracted to work a 37/ 38 hour week.
As legislation is being breached these companies should be held accountable.
Many thanks for all who have responded to this thread.
Liam
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Posted By Dave Daniel
Look carefully at the WT Regs - There are criteria which preclude opting out where substantive mental or physical effort is required or where a Risk Assessment says so.
Also note the RTD Directive (see my note a few days ago) may class worker as a "mobile worker" in which case from March 05 there willl be specific control on his time, if he is required to carry out some driving.
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