Posted By Peter Hamilton Hi Jason, whow thats a big question indeed. I will be first to set off down the trail with you. Lets hope others do join in. Firstly, I start from the point that it is neither practical nor prudent to try to factor in INDIVIDUAL attributes in routine risk assessment. The starting point must be to design and provide safe kit, places of work etc for users (generally). Then to consider whether special skills or attributes are required for ANY and ALL users of the workplace or kit, these then become part of your control measures. Human failure modes are well understood and are an essential part of good design. So, in theory at least, if you have good design risk assessment we all should be safe. Hah ha!! Take a look in my garage at home! or perhaps not eh?? So, it comes down having agreed ways to work that challenge our laziness, ignorance of the correct methods and risk taking human attributes, we all have them. If behaviour is not managed consistently and continuously then you get "everyday" life. If your risk assessment identifies required behaviours as well as the more normal methods of work and required skill, then you have something to manage. Of course , it all fails if no-one bothers to make sure that what we do is what we said we would do; with the kit we said we would use; in the way we agreed: in the place we assessedand agreed, now thats where the real failures happen!!!?? I am conscious that this is a very superficial response to your huge question but time presses and maybe it will prompt some more responses for us?? Peter

Posted By Jason Gould Thanks for your input Peter. It was a big question I know. I must admit we were discussing this in a pub last night so beer took over after say 1 hour. I would go with what you said about safe place, kit etc. And like others probably would keep them seperate and manage the risk. Here what was thrown at me. Him "Once you have a safe place RA and a safe system of work, with a trained employee. Does that mean that the employees are then responsible for their own accidents?" Me "Its not that simple, you have to consider behavior and other factors such as the Job, peer, attitude etc." Him "So these RAs I use are not really that good are they, yet this safety consultancy states they are comprehensive and in-depth. I mean cum on, this RA has a rating of high from the consultant point of view yet me and my lads know that this job is relatively simple and quite boring once you have done it for a while." So the way I see it, you should have two RAs, one for the Job and One for the person. That way you are prompted to look at other factors such as how boring or exciting the Job is." He started him comical p*** take of various safety Professionals he has met. I did laugh at most but then reminded him that he was the one who hired them on a cheap and cheerful basis. So he went on to say it could be done similar to a training matrix but he will discuss the possible pitfalls with the lads at work. Anyway we got drunk and I have forgot the other half of the conversation. It was fun though and this bloke is a laugh. I think he thought he was safe because he purchased some RAs a consultancy offered him. Now he knows it’s a bit deeper than that, he is determined to improve his own paperwork. His idea sounds great but I believe he will struggle implementing it. He is no dummy and I am looking forward to seeing his results. Anyway at least he should get some realistic feedback from the lads on the jobs. That alone usually opens all sort of problems to be solved.

Posted By Peter Hamilton Hi again , Jason. Now everything is crystal clear, discussing human behaviour in the pub!!! Always the best place to find interesting subjects. These days mine tend to be why Chelsea think they are so good and whether we will beat the Aussies this summer in the Ashes series--but then I am old and grey!! Your pal is expressing a view that is very common amongst senior and middle managers and owners of small businesses in my experience. (or maybe he is wiser still and just testing you out) There is a belief that somehow H&S gets done with little active involvement by "management". In this case, have some stuff written up that doesn't match what they think they know to be the case, pay for it, even though it is "rubbish". Then knock H&S as expensive and unworkable. Do they do the same thing if a supplier sends them a load of c***, just pay and complain after?? They should at least try to understand why the consultant says high risk (there are many of us who have a lot of knowledge but little competence after all, isnt that why his staff have accidents). If he thinks that it is necessary to risk assess individual employees, does he also risk assess their time keeping skills?? Probably not, he manages their behaviour. Turn up on time or be sacked. Why not try the same approach to H&S, agree how it is done and then make sure it is. Then even after all that, with or without two sets of risk assessments, however complex they may be: someone , somewhere, some day will get it wrong. Zero risk and zero accidents states do not exist. (How can I say that, thirty years of working in organsiations that honestly accept zero riks and injury as a target.) After the accident is when you need to ensure that human factors are an essential part of the investigation. Maybe, just maybe, it will be that boring, simple "low risk" task that has the passive capacity to be the root cause of their next serious accident. Who then would require some "corrective action"?? Good fun this behavioural stuff, isnt it??

Posted By Jason Gould So Stuart Do you factor this in your RAs? and therefore reduce the risk rating for specific tasks. Or do you consider this a management tool that is used after the RA is completed. I have seen some RAs that include competency as well as frequency etc. On the other hand many companies will have the RA on a specific task, rate it without experience and competency as they already have other systems in place i.e. Inductions, training supervision, job descriptions etc and SSOW. Anyway I have had a headache all day so am off to bed. Will try to explain better tomorrow. Thank for you views