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#1 Posted : 01 September 2005 12:31:00(UTC)
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Posted By Paul B Moore
A risk assessment shows it to be necessary for painters to wear protective footwear. One painter has produced a GP's letter "excusing" him from compliance on very dubious grounds. Previously he has been allowed to select his own ppe footwear without restriction to ensure comfort and fit.
It is the organisation's intention that he either complies or is reassigned a different job due to "medical" reasons (should these prove genuine).
We see no way that we (or the painter) can waive our duty of care or our liabilities for his safety. Are we being too simplistic in insisting that this is a case of doing things safely or not at all? Has anyone had a similar experience or know of a solution?
In the meantime he is being referred to an occupational physician for a second opinion.
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#2 Posted : 01 September 2005 13:21:00(UTC)
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Posted By John Watson
Paul
Sorry do not know the answer but am intrigued to know what he wears on his feet normally?

Thanks

John
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#3 Posted : 01 September 2005 13:29:00(UTC)
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Posted By Paul B Moore
Hi John,

At present he just wears trainers - though he won't accept the current very stylish trainer-style ppe footwear.
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#4 Posted : 01 September 2005 13:40:00(UTC)
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Posted By John Watson
Paul

You must have read my mind! On what "dubious" basis is the trainer style ppe not acceptable? I am really struggling to get an understanding of that? Does he have corns/bunyons etc? Even then I cannot see how the protecting bit of the shoe could affect them?

Puzzled.

John
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#5 Posted : 01 September 2005 14:22:00(UTC)
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Posted By Paul B Moore
John,

Some of the most comfortable footwear I ever had was ppe so I don't understand this individual's problems at all (although I think there is another agenda here with regard to his employment). His GP refers to "pain and skin lacerations" but I am also concerned as to whether this letter is actually genuine - hence our intention to refer him to "the big doctor".
I agree that modern ppe shoes are the least likely to cause or exacerbate foot conditions.
I would intend to insist that he wears them, with or without a doctor's letter. If he cannot comply then we will offer him alternative employment.
Paul
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#6 Posted : 01 September 2005 14:23:00(UTC)
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Posted By Pete Walker
Paul

Recent case law on disability and H&S Obligations won in favour of the employer that dismissed the employee that refused to wear protective footwear because of a medical problem. The court said the employer has an absolute duty to protect the employees and if you cannot eliminate the hazard and have made reasonable attempts to find alternative suitable protection - then to ensure the safety of your employee you may need to dismiss him.

Cae: Lane Group PLC V Farmiloe (1996 I think)

Dismiisal in this case was not discrimination but an inevitable consequence of the employers absolute duty to comply with H&S.
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#7 Posted : 01 September 2005 14:47:00(UTC)
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Posted By James M
A risk assessment will show that all personnel have to wear safety footwear as there is a significant risk of injury to their feet. Other means of removing the risk or reducing it are not suitable therefore PPE is used as the last resort.

Therefore by allowing the person to work in this area without wearing safety footwear he is still being exsposed to the risk.

You can either remove the risk or the person. If you allow the person to work there knowing that he is exposed to this risk and he has an accident, have you acted responsibly as a health and safety professional and a supervisor or manager??

My answer would be no. If he can't or won't wear the PPE he can't work there. Simple.
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#8 Posted : 01 September 2005 15:00:00(UTC)
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Posted By gham
Will he make a claim against your company or the doctor when he crushes his toes and can't do any job

theres always a solution PPE has come a long way, the specialist should be able to help or have a consultant appointed via your insurance company. we had a simmilar problem with an office employee who would to wear any PPE provided on the advise of occupational therpists because of poor comfort and rejected every other offer of assistance and equipement yet still complained
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#9 Posted : 01 September 2005 15:16:00(UTC)
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Posted By rjhills
Used to have problems similar to the one you describe.
As well as risk assessment, we have ssow.
There is a copy of relevent ssow given to all wearers of PPE at induction.
Also, site rules, which are enforced by site manager or supervisor ensure that any person not having corect ppe when trying to access site are sent home for the missing ppe.
Very few repeats.
Tool box talks to employees also help.When employees are appraised of reasons, most are reasonable. Those who are not have a choice.
It works for us!!
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#10 Posted : 01 September 2005 15:36:00(UTC)
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Posted By Rhoecus2
Recently I was talking to a PPE suppliers rep.

One of his customers were being specially fitted for safety footwear due to a being issued a doctors note excusing him from wearing safety boots/shoes.

The company in question are pricing a special pair costing hundreds. The company in question feels it is worth the cost, because if their employee in question DID have an injury due to not wearing safety boots/shoes it would possibly cost them more.

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#11 Posted : 01 September 2005 16:14:00(UTC)
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Posted By Dave Dowan
Hi All
We had this problem a couple of years ago , the risk assessment specified safety boots , the employee said he could not wear the issue ones , we had him fitted with the Gucci versions, 6 months down the line he again said he could not wear boots ( manager changed and he tried it on )
We stood our ground and said as we had done all we could AFARP and the job required employees to wear safety foot wear he would be assigned another (less lucrative) post
Guess what his feet got better
Dave
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#12 Posted : 02 September 2005 00:23:00(UTC)
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Posted By douglas erskine
ask the painter to place the letter on his foot
then drop a block on it and see if the letter protects his foot! If he can't wear correct ppe then he can't carry out his duties safely.
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#13 Posted : 02 September 2005 08:30:00(UTC)
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Posted By Karen Todd
We sent our complainers along with their safety shoes to a chiropodist.

Some did have genuine feet problems and needed custom made inserts (can't remember the proper name for them at the minute). They had to wear the inserts not just with their safety shoes, but with their ordinary shoes as well.

Most were very grateful, as until that point they didn't know there was anything wrong with their feet.

Non-genuine complaints soon died out.

KT
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