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#1 Posted : 17 July 2006 11:25:00(UTC)
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Posted By J Knight Hi Folks, So an enclosed space has to have a roof, and be enclosed for 50% of its perimiter; or at least that's how it stands in Scotland and is likely to be the same on the rest of the UK mainland. So; we have a smoking area under the kitchen at one of our Care Centres; it's a courtyard open on one side, and it has a 'roof' in the shape of the kitchen floor above. Though it is by any common-sense token outside, would this be be regarded as enclosed under the current Scottish regime? It quite clearly has only one open side, having walls at three sides, but has never been part of the interior of the building. The kitchen floor is about 10 feet above the level where people sit to smoke, and the projection of the kitchen is about 20 feet from the back wall of the courtyard, John
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#2 Posted : 17 July 2006 11:37:00(UTC)
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Posted By Paul Adams By definition of the reg, this is an enclosed space and therefore smoking in such a space in Scotland is illegal.
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#3 Posted : 17 July 2006 12:25:00(UTC)
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Posted By J Knight Thanks Paul, That's what I had suspected, John
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#4 Posted : 17 July 2006 12:33:00(UTC)
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Posted By Breezy It does however make it particularly frustrating, as we (like you, John) have an area outside one of our premises that would be an ideal location, but for the fact that it is 55% enclosed due to the nature of the building.
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#5 Posted : 17 July 2006 12:33:00(UTC)
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Posted By John Webster John, Just to confirm what Paul has advised. As an example, some of our ferries have open deck areas, with a deck above and bulkheads fore and aft. The one side has just a handrail and is open to the sea. These areas were popular with smokers when smoking was banned inside the vessels, but now, under the 50% enclosed rule, they have had to become no-smoking as well.
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#6 Posted : 17 July 2006 13:00:00(UTC)
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Posted By Ron Young I fully understand where you are coming from but if you look at the 50% rule as guidance and if you are saying that 55% is a breach of the law, strictly speaking you are correct. However, who has the time or the inclination to get the tape measure out and prove you are in breach! Now that would be a jobsworth. I would suggest that in this situation as long as there was agreement in the workforce, it's good to go. Look at me, a non-smoker advising people to break one of the most sensible laws to be passed by the Scottish Parliament...
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#7 Posted : 17 July 2006 13:15:00(UTC)
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Posted By J Knight Hi Ron, Fair comment when its, say, 50 vs 55%, but the place in question is 75% enclosed, and I feel we could be on a sticky wicket if we let it ride too far, John
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#8 Posted : 17 July 2006 13:38:00(UTC)
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Posted By Merv Newman What is defining the dimensions and enclosure of your space ? Is it the "roofed" area ? If so, then a roof which is small enough to be enclosed less than 50% by surrounding structures and/or non-contigual with others would be legal. An umbrella would do Merv
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#9 Posted : 17 July 2006 13:48:00(UTC)
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Posted By Tabs Why not paint a white line to extend the 'area' to a point of 40% roof and 50% walls? do the regs describe an area as that part under the roof as aked above? not a smoker, but can't agree that it is a good law as it stands, sorry.
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#10 Posted : 17 July 2006 13:53:00(UTC)
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Posted By Graeme From a non smoker.... They should change the law so that smokers can not smoke within 5m of any building. That would make interpretation easier.
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#11 Posted : 17 July 2006 13:54:00(UTC)
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Posted By J Knight No Tabs, Sorry but that wouldn't work, it's all the area under the roof that would count, and would in total be barred; the roof doesn't form part of the 50% John
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#12 Posted : 18 July 2006 13:52:00(UTC)
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Posted By jackw. Graeme , as the USA tennis player said "you can not be serious" what about outside pubs bars or indeed any property?... 5 m would include people just walking around and smoking in a "public" place. Can I put you up for policing this 5m rule on a saturday night in and around Glasgow City Centre.? Cheers. see you in casualty!!!! Cheers.
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