Posted By ITK
It is in the guidance to Regulation 4 of MHOR 1992.

Page 12 to be specific.

Posted By tommy_t
Page 15 Recording the assessment paragraph 66

Posted By The toecap
Recording the assessment
66 In general, the significant findings of the assessment should be recorded
and the record kept, readily accessible, as long as it remains relevant. However,
the assessment need not be recorded if:
(a) it could very easily be repeated and explained at any time because it is
simple and obvious; or
(b) the manual handling operations are of low risk, are going to last only a
very short time, and the time taken to record the assessment would be
disproportianate

Posted By The toecap
Ah well you see. Up there for thinking down there for kicking

Posted By Philip McAleenan
Al,

It’s always worth discussing your concerns with your consultant and asking him/her to clarify any points of doubt. That’s what you pay your fees for. Anyway. here is the specific UK regulation relating to the assessment. No mention to record or not to record in it.

4.—(1) Each employer shall—
(a) …; or

(b) where it is not reasonably practicable to avoid the need for his employees to undertake any manual handling operations at work which involve a risk of their being injured—

(i) make a suitable and sufficient assessment of all such manual handling operations to be undertaken by them, having regard to the factors which are specified in column 1 of Schedule 1 to these Regulations and considering the questions which are specified in the corresponding entry in column 2 of that Schedule,

(ii) …

(2) Any assessment such as is referred to in paragraph (1)(b)(i) of this regulation shall be reviewed by the employer who made it if—

(a) there is reason to suspect that it is no longer valid; or

(b) there has been a significant change in the manual handling operations to which it relates;
and where as a result of any such review changes to an assessment are required, the relevant employer shall make them.

On the other hand, the Management of Health & Safety at work regs. state that significant findings are to be recorded, with the emphasis being on significant,

(6) Where the employer employs five or more employees, he shall record -
(a) the significant findings of the assessment;

Hope this clarifies. Philip

Posted By Is Kismet
Hi ARB

You wrote:
"While I can see the sense in this to cut down on my paperwork, I can't find this written in the MHO Regs or ACoP, and I'm not going to adhere to it until I see it in B&W from the HSE."

and then when getting a response:
"Thank you to all! I'm still going to want to see generics from our subbies for the low risk handling, even if only so they can evidence the training given to their staff, and that they understand they need to carry it out."

This being the case it is not quite clear to me what was wanted. But I would reiterate some earlier advice - if you talk to the Consultant, he/she will talk back!

Posted By warderic
Is, I suggest you read my comments more carefully before making such remarks. The fact is insurance companies do drive risk assessments to the extreme. The HSE do not require written risk assessment for every task unless their is a significant risk. The end result is, that we, encouraged by the insurance companies, have created endless paperwork, most of which has no real meaning. Why do you think the HSE have introduced new guidelines on risk assessments?

Posted By Philip McAleenan
It is often posted on this site that written risk assessments are required where there are significant risks. In reality the regulations require that an employer record the significant findings of an assessment, which is a different matter entirely.

A finding is a conclusion arrived at after examining of the facts of the situation.
For it to be significant it must have an important influence or effect on the proposed activity or operation.

By way of example, an assessment of a work operation that shows all the necessary controls to be in place must conclude, “work operation safe to proceed”.

Alternatively, where essential controls have yet to be identified or implemented the conclusion must be “work operation not safe to proceed”.

Both of these are significant findings, the former permitting the continuation of the work operation, the latter prohibiting it, and by extension requiring that the operative/manager do more before he can give the go-ahead.

It is up to the individual how much more they wish to write into their record of findings, but it would be preferable if time and energy were devoted to developing and implementing the necessary control mechanisms, and writing safe working procedures if these are required than writing volumes of risk assessments.

Note too that the requirement is to make finding of fact. This negates the necessity of preparing one of the many elaborate risk matrices that preponderate, as these are neither facts nor a means of determining the significance of a finding of fact.

Regards, Philip

Posted By warderic
Is, as expected you are firing from the hip again. Our ethos is much the same as others. We carry out risk assessments in the interest of reducing risk to our employees. We carry out risk assessments over and above because when a claim comes in the insurance company will ask for the risk assessments for everthing including passing wind. If you dont have them, in most cases you will be writting a cheque. Yes you can argue before an event as you did, but arguing after the event is a different matter.

Posted By ARB
I didn't think it would stir up this much interest.

I was originally told this piece of info. from one of my sub-contractor's consultants. His thread was along the line of " We don't have to give you manual handling risk assessments because......". Bearing in mind that this is a construction company, I have seen them carry out manual handling tasks with significant risks attached.

Not wishing to tar all of the good consultants out there, but I don't believe everything consultants tell me, as I've been given poor / totally incorrect advice in the past.

ARB

Posted By Is Kismet
The HSE also suggest this in their Manual Handling RA form/template for manual handling - if it is low risk then you don't complete the full form.

Posted By Chris Pope
I have found insurers willing to listen to informed decision making, so that genuine risks can be addressed. Don't get bogged down, into doing things you just don't believe will reduce danger.