Posted By Davelfc
I would like to confirm my understanding of the above.

I believe there to be three areas of qualification for the above

(AP)Appointed Person - Who Plans the lift
Lift Supervisor - Who Supervises the Lift
Slinger Signaller - Conducts the lift

Background:
I have recently organised some training for management and staff in my organisation with a view to us planning managing and conducting our lifts on site and raising awareness.

we have trained experienced slinger signallers and qualified and experienced Appointed Persons.

The appointed persons have been in the industry a long time and some have slinger signaller training/experience, they are now project and site managers.

Question:

Can the qualified (AP)be appointed the the lift supervisor, once he or another AP have conducted the lift plans?

Reason for the Question: Some of my chaps have just been retrained having conducted the five day appointed persons course. They have returned from their training and are saying that the training provider has mentioned that as well as AP and Slingers signallers we must have additional trained Lift Supervisors to supervise the lift operations?

My previous understanding is that a qualified AP who is also trained and experienced Slinger Signaller, has tools in his tool box and so long as we appoint him as such in the lift plan he is deemed a competent Lift supervisor. Or am I missing a trick here, surely if you are competent to plan a lift and competent to conduct a lift you are competent to supervise a lift, particularly the one you have planned?

My aim here is to ensure we have the correct competencies on site.

Regards
Dave

Posted By Davelfc
Ian

many thanks for your prompt response.

I maybe should have worded better, The AP who writes our lift plans (projects or site managers all AP Trained) would, nominate himself or another AP in the organisation to be the lift supervisor, who would control the lifting arrangements (this would normally be the logistics manager (Also AP trained)) There are then a number of trained slinger signallers slinging and making safe the loads, unloading vehicles.

the main gist and my question is though I have these competent people do I also have to have trained lift supervisors as this is what a local training organisation have told three of my managers who have recently re qualified to CPCS standard AP. They are telling them that they not only need an AP and slinger signallers some one else must be trained as a lift supervisor. That the qualified AP is not competent to supervise the lift, even after conducting the 5 day AP course?

This is what I want clarification of, my perception was that if you have a qualified AP he could supervise the lift or delegate the responsibility of lift supervisor in the lift plan and RA/Method Statement to another qualified AP.

This provider is saying in addition we need to train lift supervisors? If this is a legal requirement we are prepared and will send personnel for additional training, probably senior slinger signallers and logistics and site managers but the latter are already AP's, would I be sending them on training they are already aware of? As they cover almost all BS7121 in the AP course, they certainly go through the five parts.

Regards

Dave

Posted By I McDonald
Hi Dave

thanks for the clarification, I understand your problem a bit more now. I personally conduct training for AP's and Crane/Lift Supervisors (this is not a plug for work!!). Whilst AP training is longer duration and more detailed, Crane/Lift Supervisor training fundamentally is a shortened, condensed version of the AP course with emphasis on complying with the AP's SSofW (lift plan, permits, etc). If the AP personally supervises the lift, why would they need any further training?

Whilst there are a number of duties, skills, etc, required to undertake the AP role, in my mind the 3 key areas are they need are experience of putting cranes to work, they are appropriately trained and have sufficient authority (i.e. competent to undertake the role). Would agree with the opinion that you may be getting squeezed for additional training revenue.

Ian