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Posted By rks
My local golf club are building a new tee and putting steps built into the side of the tee so to stop people climbing up to it and slipping in wet weather.
My question is does any body think or know if handrails should be installed as well or will just steps suffice?
Any views much appreciated.
Regards.
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Posted By MT
There would have to be a handrail. Reg 12 of the Workplace (Health, Safety and Welfare) Regulations state that a secure and substantial handrail should be provided and maintained on at least one side of every staircase. Handrails should be provided on both sides if there is a particular risk of falling for example where the stairs are heavily used or there is a risk of spillages.
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Posted By RichardJ
Is a golf Tee a place of work?
Would it depend on the number of steps?
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Posted By Paul Oliver
It may not be a place of work for golfers, but it would be for maintenance personnel.
Don't forget that if there is a forseeable risk of injury i.e someone falling over using the stairs then there will be a requirement to reduce or eliminate the level of risk.
Don't forget the "duty to protect others who may affected by your activities".
Paul
:-)
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Posted By Kenneth Patrick
What then about a handrail around the tee?
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Posted By Merv Newman
A golf course is not only a place of work, it is equivalent to a leisure centre where members of the public come to disport (odd word that) themselves.
Just as a sports center or swimming pool must take into account the H&S of members of the public so must a golf club or course.
Now, how do you inform users of your facility on how to conduct themselves in case of fire or explosion ?
Then, how do you ensure, in the case of, for example, a grass fire, that the 18 holes (maybe 19) are totally evacuated ?
And, apart from requiring the yelling of "fore", how does managment alert members of the public that there is a 50gm projectile heading their way at 100 mph ?
Am I going over the top here ?
Must have something to eat.
Roast pigeon with juniper berries ? (you can find both on a decent golf course and a well placed drive could collect both at the same time)
Merv
You would have to go a bit further afield for a decent bottle of Volney.
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Posted By Linda Kay
Over two risers is the answer to number of steps but the handrail issue could widen out to issues within disability access.
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Posted By Bob Youel
unless there is something very different about this golf situation - leave well alone - you are going over the top in my opinion - I advise many such areas so I do have experience re this subject
no wonder H&S gets a bad name
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Posted By Rob Randall
In volenti non fit injuria
People playing golf, and for that matter any other form of sport, voluntarily accept the risks involved with that.
As for greenkeepers and other employees the better option would be to provide them with spiked footwear. After all you cannot put steps with handrails all over the course, unless you are some kind of mad killjoy Philistine!
Cheers
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Posted By martin gray1
Hi all
My club has just installed steps and handrails, plus signs asking you to use them.
Regards
MG
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Posted By Troos Jacobs
Take the advice of MT.
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Posted By rks
Thanks for all the responses.
I personally was thinking of advising them to put sleepers in the side of the steps (it is being built into the side of the tee)and it is only 3/4 steps high and then covering in a non slip surface or etching the surface of the wooden steps as to give grip.
These other ideas have given me food for thought.
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Posted By BB
It goes without saying that protecting the clubhouse and greens staff goes without saying. Install sensible precautions around the course, i.e. steps etc, is a sound decision but before the non-golfing pedants get stuck in - LET'S NOT GET STUPID.
Earlier posting......Workplace regs quoted, two handrails, risk of spillages....give me strength! It's a golf course and by definition it gets wet and on occasion slippery. I suppose that there'll be edge protection around the pot-bunkers next!
There is one game that relies on high levels of personal conduct, self-policing and consideration for others. (There's not even any need for an umpire or referee to keep the chavs in order) - it's called GOLF. Some of the inverted snobs may have another slant.
This single figure handicap CMIOSH is very happy to get to the course to escape the normal bureaucratic atrocities often foisted on us.
Keep it real. Please. For the sake of my sanity.
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Posted By Steve Cartwright
BB
Could not agree more. I too play golf and have had many a joyful experience watching golfers fall into ponds/ditches trying to retrieve a golf ball worth 50p, climb trees or wade into a pond to retrieve a club they have just thrown, slip on their bottoms whilst stepping in and out of bunkers etc. Its all part of the game.
And guess what? They all come back the following week to have another go. Even the one's who get hit with a golf ball.
Have to pick you up on one thing though. The Pro's do have referee's.
Steve
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Posted By Andrew Meiklejohn
Morning all
IMO i would be very careful when using volentia non fit injuria...
Vowles v Evans and Others 2003
as for chavs on the golf course...
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/...hern_ireland/3084451.stm
as for the steps... if it has been risk assessed and that is a control measure then you have to do it.
Andrew
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Posted By BB
Steve,
Good point about the referee, but let's be honest...the pros aren't real golfers are they?
They're a right bunch of jessies! I mean, I've never met one that can duck-hook like me! And they rarely play following a hangover, standing on the first tee after wolfing down a runny egg and bacon sandwich, simultaneously belching and breaking wind, taking a singular warm-up practice swing before tearing the course up.
Now that's proper golf!
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Posted By N Smith
As golfers we all know the risks when we enter the courses. Most courses I have visited have taken "reasonable" steps to protect members of the public.
Where will this end, courses providing eye protection for use in the bunkers, hard hats for awkward driving holes.
Perhaps we should set up an IOSH Discussion Forum Working Group to test the Health and Safety standards at different courses - now that the Summers here
Neil
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Posted By David Bruce
If you have ever visited a golf club during a normal week day you will see that they are a lot of players who are fit to walk round the course but due to age have difficulty with steep slopes etc... Therefore if the course choses to provide steps at players request I think this is justified.
However, a large cause of slips is usually the grass cuttings collecting on their spikes. I recommend providing fixed brush cleaners for shoes every few holes to remove much of the slip risk for very little cost.
Furthermore the suggestion of a fixed handrail creates its own risks as wayward shots can rebound from these(particularly if this is the womens tee and is in front of the main tee). If the steepness does require a form of handrail I would suggest a thick rope style that is visually in keeping with the course
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Posted By Rob Randall
Hi all,
in response to Andrew Meiklejohn can I say IMHO that the case of Vowles v Evans was a civil claim for damages resulting from the negligence by a rugby referee in failing to apply the Laws of Rugby. It has nothing whatever to do with the HASAW Act or any associated SI's.
I stick to my guns, volenti non fit injuria for the players, after all the game does involve a long walk in open country on often wet grass. I would add that sensible precautions for the golf club employees do not have to include steps and handrails and edge protection and hard hats and so on. Please let's be realistic and sensible about this.
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Posted By MT
I don't think that installing a simple handrail at one side of the stairs when they are built is "health and safety gone mad" at all. Many golf players are elderly and have difficulty getting up slopes as well as steps. When someone falls on the steps and there is no handrail, how can the decision not to install one be justified? It's foreseeable that someone could fall on a set of steps and the solution is simple, so why the resistance?
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Posted By Darren J Fraser
Lets keep it real.
Steps have been provided, to stop people falling down the bank, do we need to provide a handrail?
I have yet to visit a golf course that is flat, therefore should handrails be provided -of course(no pun intended)not.
As for the green keepers - they will be more aware of the hazards created by nature, without someone adding handrails as well, than any member of the public.
There are enough natural hazards on a golf course without adding some more.
Next thing you know, some group will be trying to ban a game enjoyed by many, played well by a few (unlike myself, lucky if the ball goes straight) on the grounds of health and safety.
Anyway being hit by a golf ball travelling at 100+mph, with a titanium core, does not hurt after the 3rd pint, it is the hangover.
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Posted By BB
Bruce,
What an excellent posting - I'll suggest the rope solution at my place.
Darren,
Yep, it hurts when you get hit by a badly driven ball. One of our green staff got hit by a senior member a year or two ago and was pretty ill for a few days. The member was disciplined as a result (suspended and warned)and the RA and controls reviewed.
Incidentally, I think you'll find the only titanium bit of any golf ball is the titanium oxides used to make it look very white. This is a good old fashioned con that adds nothing to the playability of the ball, but allows Wilson (et al) to market Ti balls.
Have a lovely golfing weekend!
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Posted By BB
Sorry, Dave!
Having a 'trigger' moment.
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Posted By Fornhelper
What next !!! Footballers at work...possible head injury against goalpost....pad out the goalposts!!!
FH
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Posted By Merv Newman
Trying to be real. I'm not a golfer. Tried it once, lost my balls.
More than a couple of steps and why not a rope handrail ? (and who was that being sexist about the ladies tee ?)
Forn, why do you think they pad the goal posts for rugby matches ? As an old (very) prop forward I can tell you they reallyreally hurt.
Merv
But, yeah. Three pints is pretty good first aid. And I can tell you that you can still have a pretty good game of darts with your right arm in a sling. But you need the three pints first.
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Posted By Raymond Rapp
I play golf all over the country and in many countries. Hazards on the course are an integral part of the game. That said, this particular course have identified an issue and are remedying the problem with the provision of steps, which is more than some courses do including my own!
Whether handrails are needed will partly depend on the amount of steps, the degree of the incline and whether it would spoil the course ambiance. As a rule I would say they are not really needed. Golfers tend to be a reasonably able bunch of people and treating a golf course like a workplace is not in the best interests of anyone.
Regards
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Posted By Merv Newman
Ray,
you haven't seen the OAPs on our local course. (I'm one of them) 10 for a three is about average (we don't do the 250 yard stuff anymore) and anything more than a 25° slope needs a nurse. Sometimes an ambulance.
Funfunfun
Merv
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Posted By Raymond Rapp
Merv
They say truth is stranger than fiction, but when I suggested that a few steps should be put on our 7th tee so that golfers can see others down a dip. The committee said that some of the old folk would not be able to climb them.
My response, these old duffers are not the ones likely to carry a ball 230 yards plus through the air!
Ray
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Posted By Merv Newman
Ray,
I don't see me doing 250. 25 is about right.
And really its the walk that counts.
I vote for the steps with rope handrails.
And easy access to an ambulance. There should be one at each hole.
Merv
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