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#1 Posted : 03 May 2007 09:03:00(UTC)
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Posted By Sue Wood Our organisation is planning to introduce a smoking ban for the building and its premises, but we are concerned about the implications of people smoking in their own private vehicles. The legislation is clear that people are not banned from smoking in their own vehicles, just company vehicles. However, if private vehicles are parked on our property, are we able to state that smoking is banned on the premises, including any vehicles which are parked there? Has anyone come across this issue, or dealt with it in their policy? Any feedback or comments would be appreciated!
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#2 Posted : 03 May 2007 09:15:00(UTC)
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Posted By Tabs Question: Why would you want to? - unless it is a refinery or such. Legality: Yes, you can probably introduce the policy, and make it a condition of parking being allowed - but I would suggest you would be being a bit OTT. Is there a real benifit, or risk, involved? Or is it making rules for rules sake?
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#3 Posted : 03 May 2007 09:29:00(UTC)
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Posted By Sue Wood We are a secondary school, with a community area attached to it, so we have a number of staff and general public coming in and parking vehicles in the car park. I wanted to gather comments or information from people about their experiences/thoughts and then I can feed it back to the Senior Management for their final decision! Many thanks for your feedback.
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#4 Posted : 03 May 2007 09:56:00(UTC)
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Posted By mike morland Hi Sue We have always had a 'No Smoking' policy for our site which includes no smoking in private vehicles. It is accepted by all employees and we have never had any problems. We adopted this 'rule' because some people who smoke in their own cars are capable of winding down the window and disposing of lighted butt ends rather than properly extinguishing them in their car ash tray. We have provided a designated 'smoke lobby' for tea breaks but this is planned to be removed soon as we go 'smoke free' on the 1st July 2007.
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#5 Posted : 03 May 2007 10:30:00(UTC)
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Posted By Steve Cartwright Yes you can ban smoking in private vehicles in your car parks. We did it. We are now a no smoking site. Quite a few moaned before the ban came into force. Now everyone has accepted it. The problem we had was staff were taking unofficial smoke brakes. We calculated that on average the company was losing 85 man hours every week. That was based on each smoker taking 2 unofficial smoke breaks a day. Now everyone works their full contracted hours. Isn't life a B****.
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#6 Posted : 03 May 2007 13:14:00(UTC)
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Posted By Ron Hunter Your intentions are admirable. If your Policy intent is to ban smoking anywhere on the grounds then surely this already includes the car park and your question is answered? Your smoking policy can (through proper channels of negotation and consultation) extend beyond any legislative requirements and be applied to employees as a condition of employment. Enforcing this policy w.r.t to m.o.p. is an entirely different matter.Even some hospitals have problems in that respect. If the end result of your policy is members of staff congregating just outside the school grounds at break times then your policy could be self-defeating (setting an example and all that). A discrete external area within the grounds might then be a better bet. If your ban is to be effective then cleaning and catering contractors have to play their part ( this can be a problem), and of course a hard line would have to be taken with those pupils who have a puff behind the bike sheds! Yours, a reformed smoker.
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#7 Posted : 03 May 2007 15:34:00(UTC)
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Posted By Tracey C Hi Sue I would agree with tabs, unless you have a valid safety reason on site why bother. How are you going to police it? If it is staff members that are smoking they are breaching their employment contract. But what about human rights, if the vehicle belongs to that person are they not entitled to smoke in it if they wish. What if they are a visitor to the site would you have them removed for smoking in their own vehicle? If so under what legislation? Just for the record i am a none smoker, never smoked in my life. I just feel if people are not harming others they should be entitled to smoke if they wish. Just think if everybody stopped smoking where would the government get that extra money from! Sometimes banning something is not always the answer. We ban candles in our halls of residence but we have had 6 fires this year started by candles!!! T
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#8 Posted : 03 May 2007 17:04:00(UTC)
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Posted By Descarte Disagree with Tabs, when someone smokes in their vehicle how often do they put out the fag in their car? They dont they flick it out the window. So yes I think that the ban should cover this, reduce the litter, fire risk, and come on, its at a secondary school.
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#9 Posted : 03 May 2007 21:01:00(UTC)
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Posted By Ian Waldram I think your question has been well answered above. Just for the record, though, IOSH HQ has been No Smoking since 1 Jan 2007, except for a small shelter in the grounds. This applies for all staff, visitors, etc. and includes smoking in private cars. Staff were widely consulted and involved, but of course it was difficult to do that for visitors - and there are several training courses and committees on most working days. No problems have been reported to date on implementing this.
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#10 Posted : 04 May 2007 10:20:00(UTC)
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Posted By GWP In Scotland smoking is already banned with most companies encountering few problems. Most companies have gone for a blanket ban in line with local councils, prohibiting smoking anywhere on the premises. This eliminates any grey areas. The incoming law will dictate what measures have to be taken and guidance should be available. G
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#11 Posted : 04 May 2007 11:11:00(UTC)
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Posted By Tabs Descarte - then perhaps the rule should be made to stop people throwing butt-ends out of the car? I understand the image of a smoke-filled car on a secondary school car park is a bad example to pupils, but perhaps stress management would be better than a ban? And no, I don't smoke. But perhaps I would if I were locked up with school kids for six hours a day!
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#12 Posted : 04 May 2007 11:36:00(UTC)
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Posted By JWG All NHS sites are now (or very soon) supposed to be no-smoking. This includes any outside areas. It has been written into our no smoking policy that if staff are caught smoking on the site then disciplinary proceedings will be followed. Yes a few may still smoke but they are running a risk if caught. The biggest culprits are contractors and ambulance staff. A stern threat soon stubs that out for those individuals.
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#13 Posted : 04 May 2007 13:09:00(UTC)
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Posted By Robert K Lewis Just off message a little - Why do we let ourselves as H&S practitioners always be landed with the jobs HR want to avoid but should really be able to do best. It leads us into the "elf and safety spoilsport spotlight" when perhaps we could pass it across for some other profession to take the hit. I can see no smoking sites being negotiated with employees but can one do the same for members of the public in public areas? The law is on their side so just how enforceable is it? Will you ban visitors to dying persons because they smoked outside or would you merely ban them from say treatment if they become ill at some point in the future? I rather suspect byelaws may be required to prevent such smoking in the open air - Having said that I am one of the "shoot the smokers" brigade, as a rabid ex-smoker I feel entitled to take the stance. Bob
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