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Posted By Stefan Daunt
I have just read a letter in my local news paper voicing concerns over cyclists without lights in the dark hours, paper boys was 1 of a group mentioned. It got me thinking that as I have a duty of care for my fleet drivers, surely a news agent has one for the safety of his employees I.e in this case his paper boys who are riding without lights.
Would this would come under section 2 of the H+S work act, safe transport? If the news agent worked on his own in the shop but employed 5 paperboys then he would have to surely carry out a risk assessment for the delvery of the papers.
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Posted By Lilian McCartney
Hi Stefan,
You're right
paper boys come under HSW and newsagents are responsible.
I think several years ago there was a case on this? (can't remember details but I'm sure someone will).
There's also a manual handling issue - but then again golf caddies carry bags when there are wheeled trolleys avialable! (I'm stirring it a bit today)
Lilian
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Posted By Michelle L Dugard
There was also a lobbying effort regarding the weight of some of the quality papers that these poor youngsters had to heave around - particularly on a Sunday! I believe one of them weighed in at a hefty 12lb in one example.
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Posted By MT Of course! If it was a newsagent with 5 paper delivery boys/girls, then he would have to carry out and record the findings of a risk assessment. This would have to include a restriction on the weights of the bags sent out, organisation of delivery routes, safety of the staff (i.e. do the they return to the shop at the end of their round or go straight home and if they go home, do they phone in to say that they are home safe?), checks on bikes - bakes, lights, provision of hi-vis clothing. There's a good leaflet here: http://www.nfrnonline.co...ering-Safety-Leaflet.pdf
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Posted By Ali
Riding any cycle on a public highway without lights would probably contravene the statutory Highway Code regardless if the person was employed or not. The employers would definitely need to check this was being done as part of the risk assessment process.
Ali
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Posted By Mark Duff
Regardless of the number of staff employed, the newsagent must still undertake a risk assessment. With paperboys, the assessment must further consider the lack of maturity of the employees. Having less than five employees only exempts the employer from recording the significant findings of the assessment not from undertaking it.
Duffer
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Posted By Karen Todd
Yes, and as I understand it a work permit would also be required from the education authority.
How many newsagents do you think have work permits for their paperboys/girls???
KT
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Posted By Karen Todd
To clarify - the yes was to the requirement for RA.
As regards "workplace transport", don't paperboys use their own bikes?
KT
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Posted By Stefan Daunt
True most paper boys do use their own bikes, same as company car drivers use their own cars, but as an employer you still have to ensure that they are safe for road use.
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Posted By Ali
....Risk assessment may still be required in written form - refer to Young Persons Risk Assessment. The newspaper boy is still carying out his employers undertaking even if he is using his own bike, so the employer should still assess this.
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Posted By Graham Bullough
Just to add another angle on this topic. In addition to the newsagents - the employers - having a legal and moral obligation to check that teenagers delivering papers for them have lights on their bikes (and bikes kept in reasonable working condition as regards brakes, etc.) surely the parents should be checking on such things.
However, perhaps I'm unrealistic to expect many parents to bother these days, as it seems to be the norm for many cyclists - of all ages - not to display any lights on their bikes when there is little or no daylight. In addition, a proportion of cyclists with lights think they're legal but fail to realise that their lights are too dim to be of any use in alerting other road users of their presence.
A couple of years ago I wrote a letter headed "Kamikaze Cyclists" to my local newspaper to highlight (possible pun there) the problem and suggested that many people (police, schools, parents, other relatives and friends of cyclists) had the capacity to improve the situation. Though the newspaper decided it was a "star letter" and sent me £15 I've no idea if it had any effect on any readers.
Even so, I'll repeat the gist of the letter for readers of this discussion: If you have kids, other relatives or friends with bicycles, do they have effective lights? If not, assuming you have any concern for them, consider what you could and should do about it - discuss, cajole or better still buy them some decent lights - they're not expensive and not difficult to fit.
No apologies for this diversion from the original thread because it's only a partial diversion and underpins why the thread needed to be raised in the first place.
Graham (motorist, cyclist & pedestrian)
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