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Duty of care under the RRFSO, clarification required.
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Posted By Lisa_
Hi Guys,
Just had a curve ball thrown at me and all text books are sitting on the dining table very far away.
Q1.
Within a fire risk assessment for general needs properties would you need to address the needs of any vunerable persons living there? Potentially people with mental or physical issues that could restrict thier ability to safely evacuate. These buildings have no-one working in them and have automatic detection. Any supported services given to the customer is through thier own private arrangements. We just rent them a flat.
Q2.
Would the same apply for leasehold properties where we are the managing agents?
Thoughts please ??
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Rank: Guest
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Posted By Brenda H
Hi Lisa,
General needs properties our assessments include the needs of the user. This is from two perspectives; the first being whether any additional controls are needed because of any mental issues. i.e. if you have someone who has a history of arson then it may be appropriate to have additional fire detection/fighting measures.
The same if you have someone with mobility problems then you need a plan in place which reflects this an details what will happen to manage this in the event of an evacuation.
With regards to the second question we only assess communal areas as it is the tenant's responsibility to look after their own flat. However, in some HMO's we equip the kitchen area with a fire blanket.
I'm sure others will add their opinions on what is right or wrong. But this approach we follow is on advice from our local fire brigade.
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Rank: Guest
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Posted By pluto
Lisa and Brenda H
This is a really difficult problem legally and one that enforcers have yet to really come to terms with.
Does the FSO apply? If the premises is occupied as a private dwelling which is not used in common by the occupants of more than one such dwelling...i.e the occupants all live as a family group and do not live in a way more akin to a HMO, then the Order probably doesn't.
If this is the case then the rest of your question becomes legally irrelevant in respect of the Fire Safety Order.
If the premises have live-in or permanent carers, (rather than domestic servants) then the Order applies and the tenants probably become 'relevant persons' and their particular needs have to be considered. When do carers become live-in or permanent? After four hours, eight hours, over night? Who knows.
A nurse turning up occasionally for dressing changes etc, would not count.
If the Order doesn't apply then the moral duty most certainly does in my opinion.
You might find that the Housing Act and the HHSRS may be easier to use and force open any reluctant budgets, especially for people with quite severe needs. The Housing Act would define this as a shared house which under the 2004 Act is also a HMO.
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Rank: Guest
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Posted By Adrian Watson
Dear Lisa,
1. No; it is domestic premises and out side the remit of the order. Furthermore you have no control over the premises.
2. Yes; insofar as the general fire precautions affect persons within the premises with special needs, but only to the extent that you have control as a managing agent.
Regards Adrian Watson
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