Posted By Robert_N
HI ALL,

Please could you clear up a point for RIDDOR?
If a worker was to be hurt on say a Wednesday but carry on working then Thursday leave early saying the the injury from Wednesday was hurting to much to carry on have Friday off as sick due to injury not in Saturday because he wasn't due in call in sick Sunday but back to work Monday is this a RIDDOR?
Wed - Injury
Thur - Half day
Fri - Sick
Sat - Not due in
Sun - Sick
Mon - Back

I hope you can understand this.

Posted By Robert_N
I believe this is a RIDDOR but others are telling me you don't include rest days when working it out.

Posted By Carl West
Definately Reportable !

Posted By Dave Daniel
This has always been a point of contention which the HSE's wording of RIDDOR does not help. The problem is not new and the old Factories Act had a similar glitch.

The normal accepted practice as far as I am concerned was to assume that if the guy was in for work on Monday, he had been capable of working over the weekend, but if he was off Friday & Monday then his spell of incapacity was continuous. Just make sure his absence is actually due to the accident. You should get a self-cert form filled in which lets the IP clearly define whether his absence is occupational or not.

To my knowledge this has not ever been challenged. I know there are those that think everything should be reported regardless, but if you report too much then you get criticised for having a high "accident" rate....

Posted By A Campbell
Dave,

I understand that the old 'black mark' syndrome is prevelant when you inform senior management regarding RIDDOR reporting, but the guidence is clear and calculating if a person was due off or not is irrelevant.

If you decide to have a seperate recoring system to eliminate this, such as a true reflection of lost man hours (as he/she wasn't supposed to really work that time of the week) then that should be promoted to the board.

I had very similar problems in the oil industry some moons ago due to sending people home via the doctor/hospital and if was due hometime anyway this was deducted to reduce reporting over 3 day incidents... I'm sure it was and isn't confined to that industry either.

Policy for reporting should be honest and open.. if management cannot do this how would you react to the workforce not doing it... apart from the obvious large injuries?

Posted By A Campbell
It is very clearly defined as to reporting lost consequative days on L73 - Guidence note 58
'When calculating `more than three consecutive days' the day of the accident should not be counted, only the period after it. Any days the injured person would not normally have been expected to work, such as weekends, rest days or holidays, must be included'

Report them!

Posted By A Campbell
A little harsh Mike!

I think the confussion is that the IP didn't decide the injury was going to prevent him from working until the Thursday.
In such case Robert may be thinking that it is calculated from that day and not from the actually day of injury (Wednesday)
As you do not include the day of the incident it may have swayed to use the Thursday as the injury day?

Either way, the advice is to report it, using the Thursday as the 1st day of absence.

Posted By Mike Craven
No - not harsh at all Tony!

I wasn't having a go at, or criticising the OP Robert; he asked a perfectly legitimate question about RIDDOR - giving details of the case - as he, and anyone else, is perfectly entitled to do.

The problem I have is that someone has then responded by advising Robert - and the rest of the world, (this is an open public forum) - that he shouldn't include weekends/rest-days in the calculations when working out whether or not an absence is over three days. If Robert were to accept and take that advice, he and his employer could be in breach of RIDDOR and might find themselves facing action from HSE

There is plenty of room for opinion and people are entitled to differing points of view. What I object to is people offering information which is clearly incorrect - that is what I was robustly challenging

Mike

Posted By Swis
Definately Reportable

Posted By Peter Farrell
Sorry, if my response mis-led. I didn't mean they didn't count, what I meant was that you cannot be on holiday if you have reported sick and if you are on holiday an official holiday from work then you are not recorded as sick.

Clear as mud, I think I will stop there as it is easier to explain than to write.

Posted By Peter Farrell
RIDDOR states 'Subject to regulation 10, where a person at work is incapacitated for work of a kind which he might reasonably be expected to do, either under his contract of employment, or, if there is no such contract, in the normal course of his work, for more than three consecutive days (excluding the day of the accident but including any days which would not have been working days) because of an injury resulting from an accident arising out of or in connection with work (other than one reportable under paragraph (1)), the responsible person shall as soon as practicable and, in any event, within 10 days of the accident send a report thereof to the relevant enforcing authority on a form approved for the purposes of this regulation, unless within that period he makes a report thereof to the Executive by some other means so approved'.

I have however checked with HSE and they would expect the employer to ask the IP on return if they would have been able to carry out the duties if they were not on holiday (as the person may not have had time to go to the DR's to get a note. It is up to the company to check.

I still think that the person should be responsible to report sick, but this is probably upto your on policy.

Posted By Brian Dawson
QUOTE: " - - with manufacturing finishing at Friday lunchtime. If we have an accident on a Thursday and the IP doesn't come in for the Friday morning then it's automatically a RIDDOR"

I don't think that is right. It's reportable if the IP is absent (or incapacitated for work - - ) for more than 3 consecutive days; and the day of the accident should not be counted. So, in YOUR scenario with an accident on a Thursday and return on Monday morning they will have been absent for 3 days excluding the day of the accident, which is not MORE THAN 3 days.

Also to be strictly correct, when deciding whether days they would not normally work should be included, it depends on whether they were 'fit for normal work' on the days in question. As the guidance says this may involve some judgement (and asking them}.

Posted By MT
Neil, how so? When the employees return to work on the monday morning, you simply ask them if they would have been able to work on saturday or sunday. If they were fit for work, then it's not reportable.