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#1 Posted : 01 April 2009 16:59:00(UTC)
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Posted By Brenda H
Where fire detection systems are put in communal stairwells and corridor areas in blocks of flats, is it essential to have manual call points? Is it enough if the automatic detection also sounds?

The (obvious) problem with the call points is intentional sabotage and activation!

The guidance talks about a clear flap over the point, but this can still be lifted and set off so I don't see the point of this?

Thanks,
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#2 Posted : 01 April 2009 22:08:00(UTC)
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Posted By Juan Carlos Arias
I suppose the purpose of the clear flaps is to prevent unintentional activation of the system by hitting the call point.
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#3 Posted : 02 April 2009 08:50:00(UTC)
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Posted By Sally
The clear flap is normally also tied in to a 'screamer' so that it is instantly obviously which alarm has been set off and who was near it. This works well in schools.
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#4 Posted : 02 April 2009 11:19:00(UTC)
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Posted By Messy Shaw
My view - indeed, my default position when completing a FRA, is that automatic detection should be avoided from common parts of flats wherever possible. (except to operate automatic smoke vents)

The building in question is described as a 'block of flats', many of which are designed with significant fire separation which may permit residents to stay in place during a fire in another flat. So does it need AFD?

Of course, those buildings with poor fire separation, including some house conversions and flats over commercial properties may need AFD.

But if there is a high likelihood of false actuations by MCP, why not consider a variation from BS 5839 and not have MCPs at all?

BS is not law and if any changes can be justified to improve safety in a specific circumstance, as long as that rationale is recorded (and reasonable), what is the problem?

After all, a building subject to regular false AFA actuations may lead to occupants completely ignoring the system or even disabling it.

So a building having multiple MCP actuations can be far more dangerous that one without any AFD at all!
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#5 Posted : 02 April 2009 13:51:00(UTC)
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Posted By water67.
Hi, you can get additional covers that are alarmed to go off if disturbed, but this may deter genuine alarms.. Are these tenanted properties. Is there any type of concierge or caretaker presence. Why do you feel you have to have alarms etc going off in the communal areas. Normal practice advice to tenants should be stay in your flat as this would be the safest place..fire service advice would be the same..of course if it is your intention that auto smoke detection/alarms will not sound but go to a monitoring station then why would you need call points.

Just a few things to consider, hopefully you will find this helpful.

Cheers
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