Posted By Lukasz Couple weeks, months ago I posted thread mentioned in the subject, but it was removed from forum as it is not related to this forum. Advice which I received before it was removed was that is more Human Resources problem than HS. Can you explain to me why it is HR problem more than HS? I will have to explain this same on Monday. Regards LK

Posted By Roly Buss There are no Regulatins covering smells at work, otherwise people could not work in smelly places such as sewage works. It is only if the smell has risks to your health when COSHH would apply. You may find that in the employee's Contract of Employment that there is a section about personal hygiene, dress code etc, and therefore HR would be the ones to carry out any disciplinary action to remedy the situation. Roly

Posted By Bob Y I didn't see the original thread. Unpleasant as it may be, it is unlikely to present a significant health risk to anyone - is it?

Posted By Bob Youel This type of thing can definitely turn out to be a H&S issue I have dealt with a number of such issues over the years and when exploring other issues the trace back to the root cause identified personal hygiene to be the problem If needed I will explain further I would say that HR & H&S work together on this one

Posted By Flic It is worth checking whether they are working with something that can give rise to an odour, such as selenium or tellurium compounds. A bit unlikely in the average workplace, but easily ruled out. Flic

Posted By Coshh Assessor People will come and complain to you about all sorts of things, the fact that they complain to you doesn't make it an H&S issue. I had one where someone wanted tongs to get teabags out of the cup. I asked them how it was a H&S issue. It was because they might burn their fingers in the tea. I asked if there were any spoons. Yes, there were spoons. I asked why they didn't use a spoon then instead of their fingers. Well, they could, but tongs would be better. Don't get distracted from what you should be dealing with!

Posted By Andrew Meiklejohn The only time I can think of personal hygiene having a connection to H&S either in the identification of mental health issues such as depression etc which can be caused by workplace/lifestyle stress or just poor personal hygiene because they can't be bothered/haven't been told of it's impportance where it can be an issue for food production. IMO Both of these are primarily HR issues as it is down to failure to communicate policy/procedure and/or faiure to manage.

Posted By Bill Elliott Certain medication prescribed for mental ill health conditions have unfortunate side effects in some people that involve the overproduction of perspiration and body odour. This may also be true for medication prescribed for other ill health conditions. Whilst this is probably not a H&S issue it may be something for referal to our Occupational Health colleagues particularly if there is an occupational link to persons condition, eg workplace induced stress. Equally there may be an underlying cause not linked to the workplace at all which will almost inevitably become an HR issue.

Posted By Bob Youel 1 case I dealt with eventually led to bullying and stress not including quality control and loss of £ issues would the poster provide more details as we have corresponded already

Posted By Lukasz At the moment I only had complaints, however, loss of quality and as you mentioned stress IMO could be result of this situation if it will be left unresolved. In this case it is more proactive approach. Up to now line manager will have meeting with particular employee to establish facts and to set goals. Link with good information: http://www.legalworkplac...ygiene-problems-elt.aspx It was observed by management when employee was working/present at main office. It was not complain by co workers. Strange, because sometimes employees travel in one vehicle for couple hours.

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Posted By John Richards There are quite a few illnesses that cause excessive body odour, and also many drugs that cause the problem. What you have to remember is that body odour is NORMAL: not withstanding other peoples reaction to it ! Some (quite a few) people react badly to deodorants and that may well be the reason why this person smells of normal body smells, rather than chemical spray additives (many of which have a msds that would make you ban them from the workplace). Maybe you should also have a word with people who carry aerosol sprays with them....since most now use a liquid petroleum gas as propellant !!!

Posted By John Richards Funnily enough the "lynx" effect on me is shortness of breath and chest pain....as in an asthma attack....

Posted By Graham Bullough As a diversion from the main thrust of this thread, how did people manage before baths and showers became commonly available and almost everybody was a member of "the great unwashed"? From school history books I vaguely recall for example that Queen Elizabeth I (of England) bathed regularly, but only once a month! Thus, she was probably quite niffy for most of the time, but I bet nobody dared to tell her. Okay, I know the Romans and Turks with their bath houses were perhaps a notable exception, though I wonder if such facilities were available to all or just wealthier people. I've occasionally read and heard that people on long expeditions without washing facilities have found that body odour becomes less of a problem over time. If this is the case, does anyone know if it because of 1) the bacteria which feed on sweat, etc and produce the offensive odour becoming less numerous/active, 2) people's sense of smell naturally adjusting to and accommodating a pervasive smell, 3) a combination of 1 & 2 and perhaps other factors? I guess that washing and laundering facilities for men on early submarines were limited, perhaps until after WW2. Are there any suitably knowledgeable forum users who could outline what facilities, if any, submarines used to have and/or how submariners coped with body odour?

Posted By Swis Agree with Coshh Assessor, H&S officer has it’s own remits. A person stressed because he was not getting paid enough for the job he’s doing is a HR matter not H&Ss. Graham – very interesting post, comic and to the point.

Posted By Peter F. What complete and utter rubbish, body odour come cause stress to someone else, bullying could occur etc. This is not a H&S issue, it's HR, management or maybe as a colleague they could speak to him. What next a risk assessment in case they do end up getting a shower, what about a COSHH assessment for the body spray. What if they use to much this could effect people in the office, how about an allergic reaction what then. May sue as this was the advice of the H&S person! Tell the person who is complaining that you are not dealing with this as you are about to stop kids playing conkers, climbing trees and you also spotted someone having fun which you must stop in case the tears get in their eyes and they fall. Other than that tell them to take it to the manager.

Posted By Graham Bullough First a general plea against getting too hung up over what is the realm of occupational safety & health (OS&H). After all, one of the reasons why many of us enjoy working in OS&H is the fact that it is highly eclectic and draws on many other disciplines such as law, technology, psychology and physiology, and liaising at times with specialists from those disciplines. Secondly, and in tune with the eclectic theme above, there is a similar thread to this IOSH thread on what appears to be a psychology forum at http://www.uncommonforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=4181 It’s worth a quick look: The responders give varying opinions and advice about if, how and by whom a niffy employee should be told of their niffiness. Some say don’t do anything while others plead that niffy people should be told, though obviously in a suitably tactful manner. At least one responder suggests that it is much better for a willing and trusted colleague of person involved to do the telling rather than a line manager. This accords with Peter48’s response just above.

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