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Posted By AJM
Hi, I am sure this may have been asked before but is CHAS accreditation of any use if you do not complete construction work. I have been asked to check into it to get it for our Company but i am sure i have heard in the past its mainly if you do construction work.
We are a recruitment agency, who are just branching out into direct labour wharehousing, nothing more at the moment.
Any help would be appreciated as i have never dealt with CHAS before.
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Posted By GeoffB4
Ring them and get it straight from the source?
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Posted By W Murray
As a recruitment agency it would bring little or no benefit to you. As Geoff says though, talk to them. 0208 545 3838.
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Posted By Dave Wilson
"CONTRACTORS" H&S Assessment Scheme
is for contractors mate this would not add value to what you do and you would unlkely get this as you would not have the process / procedures to undertake 'contracting' work.
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Posted By Swis
not very beneficial to your business
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Posted By SteveD-M
I would talk it through with the CHAS scheme office as you will probably need this registration to supply services to most local councils and some other organisations who use CHAS as their pre-qualifying assessment for all contractors/consultants and service providers.
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Posted By tom-p
I agree with Steve. We are an occupational health consultancy mainly concerned with asbestos.
In fact I am current wading through the CHAS paperwork as I write. We are doing it as we are finding that more and more public sector Clients are requiring it before we can tender for any work or in some cases even pre-qualify.
Tom
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Posted By GeoffB4
Logically then, and following on from some of these comments, the sandwich lady/man who comes in the council carpark to sell snacks (providing a service) will need to be accredited by a construction based auditing system.
Says it all really about our mindsets in the UK.
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Posted By Ian G Hutchings
Hi
I would just work out the cost of CHAS versus the return on investment. If ROI outweighs the initial cost then it is worth doing. I wouldn't personally do it unless work was pretty much guaranteed by the client. I don't understand why anyone would ask a recruitment consultancy to have CHAS.
Cheers
Ian
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Posted By Liz Maw
We are an electrical contracting company and we have found CHAS a tedious process to go through but worth it.
It does depend on the type of work you are chasing but if you work in the public sector many local authorities and government departments ask if you are CHAS accredited in tender submissions. The advantage being that if you can say yes you then don't have to complete the health and safety section of the tender document, so it can save a lot of time.
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Posted By Phil Rose
As people have said here it is doubtful that it will be particularly relevant to your business as an EA. But, looking at the question in the title of the post, I wonder if there are 2 questions in one.
As many LAs, companies etc tend to make accreditation with CHAS a requirement of doing business with them, then yes as an economic necessity I guess CHAS is to many contractors 'worth it'.
If on the other hand you are asking is the CHAS process itself 'worth it' then that is another question, the answer to which, I suspect many people will have very mixed feelings about.
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Posted By Glyn Atkinson
Look at this from a slightly different perspective - you are an employment agency who send candidates for work, either through interview for direct client employment or direct third party employment contracts?
Ie a subcontractor basis!
Do you give your own staff working on third party client premises a safety induction for your own firm?
Do you provide them with PPE that has been risk assessed as suitable for the task on the client's site?
Have they been given manual handling training prior to attending the client's site?
Are they made aware of risks from the work process that the client does eg machinery guarding, safety shutdown systems likely to be in use?
Do you ensure that the client completes a safety induction of their own on site?
For work done for local councils, for example, you would need to prove through training records that all of the above had been considered and control measures put in place.
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Posted By Dave Wilson
This is ridiculous, have we gone completely bonkers!!
This is a recruitment company not an electrical contracting company
If you supply stuff but do not 'contract'then this is not for you, if you 'supplied' ice cream to the London Borough of Merton would you really and honestly be expected to have CHAS accreditation???
If so then we really are 'conkers bonkers' and deserve all the flak we get!!!!
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Posted By AHS
A direct quote from CHAS guidance
"Of course there is nothing to stop you employing or using your consultant to make the application on your behalf. However, if we have any questions arising from your application or assessment it is right and proper that we write to you about them and where necessary discuss the issues with you, not your consultant. If you choose to pass our comments or questions on to your consultant and get their advice that is your prerogative. However please note we expect you or one of your employees (not your consultant) to respond to us."
Personally I feel that this is unnecessary and sets up barriers straightaway.
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Posted By Brian Peirce
I totally disagree AJM…. the purpose of the CHAS assessment is for the applicant (not an external consultant) to demonstrate they have health and safety arrangements in place that are compliant with the CHAS standards.
The relationship is between the CHAS assessor and the applicant company and not the external health and safety consultant.
When a company is being vetted as part of the pre qualification process for financial soundness and good employment practices would a potential buyer of services accept being referred to an external consultant to the applicant company? Of course they wouldn’t, so why should health and safety be any different?
Just as with financial propriety and good employment practices a company must themselves demonstrate that they ‘own’ and manage health and safety.
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Posted By AJM
Brian,
I asked the original question i am AJM and i never said anything about what you condemed me for. I believe you were referring to the comments made by AHS.
Alan
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Posted By AHS
Brian
If a company wishes to retain a safety consultancy or even employs one then I cannot see the problem of that person liaising with CHAS or the HSE.
A company that uses qualified safety personnel imho usually takes Safety more seriously than those who dont.
AHS
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Posted By Brian Peirce
Alan...sincere apologies, my reply was meant for AHS.
AHS... I don't have any problem with companies using the service of an external h & s consultant and there are many, many very good ones (some incompetent ones as well).
Yes, I agree that it is sometimes the case that a company which uses the services of an external h & s professional are showing a good commitment to h & s. There are also,unfortunately, many instances where a company regards h & s as something that can be wholly dealt with at arms length entirely by consultants - a sort of 'out of sight/out of mind' attitude.
The key thing, in my view is that a company should demonstrate ownership of h & s. The CHAS assessor should reasonably expect to deal direct with the company not the external h & s consultant. If the consultant has provided a good service to the company they should be confident that their advice, guidance and support will have provided the company with enough knowledge and material to deal direct with the CHAS assessor.
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Posted By Swis
Definitely not worth it....
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Posted By Peter Moran
Well...it was worth it to a client of mine that I assisted through the CHAS process...they maintained their position on an approved list of contractors and increased their workload.
I fully agree with Brian that it is for the company alone to communicate with CHAS as per their requirements particularly for the accreditation phase. They need to demonstrate knowledge of their own systems!
I'm not convinced by the statement that its committed companies that appoint qualified H&S support. Its also those that don't care a jot about safety and want to palm it off on someone elses shoulders....alas,during auditing, I've discovered there are many companies out there only too willing to oblige them and leave them shelfloads of useless generic safety documentatation with no back-up support.
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Posted By Swis
I think otherwise.
Like any other aspect of a business, I believe that preparing health and safety management system is a specialised area. A person not having an in depth knowledge of this would be an incompetent person to deal with CHAS assessors. It’s like asking a hygiene team to explain accounts of the business. If an external consultancy manages ones safety management system, they know better who and where each process of that particular management systems is applied, guiding each individual of their responsibilities under health and safety laws. There’s no point in teaching director’s responsibilities to a shop floor worker, is there??
What’s the difference between an internal H&S Officer and the external one. One thing I fail to understand is the fact CHAS assessors are willing to communicate solely with in-house safety officer – how does that prove that director is taking H&S seriously??
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Posted By Swis
The interesting question would be to ask CHAS whether they (themselves) are accredited by an external verifier?? Which standard do they adopt to assess someone’s application…
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Posted By Peter Moran
Agreed, the preparation of a safety management system is a specialist area but the application of it surely needs to be taken ownership of?
I can't see anything wrong in shop floor workers being made aware of their bosses H&S responsibilities either!
An in-house, employed H&S Officer surely reports to the Board and may have managerial duties.....
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Posted By Swis
There's a big difference between 'application' and 'implimentation'responsibilities.
If director is to apply all the health and safety measures/application, Who are you and we??? No-one would need a safety officer then....
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Posted By Swis
P>S> 'awareness' is something but in depth knowledge is something else.
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