Welcome Guest! The IOSH forums are a free resource to both members and non-members. Login or register to use them

Postings made by forum users are personal opinions. IOSH is not responsible for the content or accuracy of any of the information contained in forum postings. Please carefully consider any advice you receive.

Notification

Icon
Error

Options
Go to last post Go to first unread
AdrianW  
#1 Posted : 28 October 2009 14:07:14(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
AdrianW

Do you think that the Safety Professional should have a management qualification. The reason being, with soley H&S qualifications the H&S professional gets "pidgeon holed" as a specialist and sometimes does not get the recognition that they are part of the "management" team. With a management qualification it would give the H&S Professional an overall view of how a company is run. Apologies if this sounds long winded. I look forward to your responses.
Vamperic  
#2 Posted : 28 October 2009 15:27:35(UTC)
Rank: New forum user
Vamperic

I dont know if it would make any difference myself as I came from a management background which does put me in good stead for understanding processes and people management and all the other things that all managers do but then I am STILL "pidgeon holed" as a specialist in only heath and safety by all the other managers. its annoying but I live with it and soldier on.
keith1983  
#3 Posted : 28 October 2009 15:32:48(UTC)
Rank: New forum user
keith1983

It dpends very much on the company structure, for example I have authority over people on H&S matters but not on others. Although I do think it important that H&S professionals have some kind of people management skills as communicating with people on all levels is an important part of the H&S professionals job.
Steve Granger  
#4 Posted : 28 October 2009 15:34:28(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Steve Granger

I think they should have management competence.......

Supervisory Steve
jwk  
#5 Posted : 28 October 2009 15:48:47(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
jwk

I'm partly with Steve; they should have management competence. However, management (beyond supervisory management) does benefit from knowledge, which can be gained by studying for a qualification. I think part of me feels that the NEBOSH Dip (and equivalent) and BSc courses ought to include some management skills; but then many management courses (including MBAs) don't include any H&S.

I had management training in bite sized chunks through in-house provision and I thought I was doing OK, but for the last couple of years I've been doing the IRM's International Dip in Risk Management, which is very clearly set out to give weight to both the words in the title. My theoretical understanding of what management does and why has improved greatly as a result, and I think it has made me a better manager. It also has helped me to think more like my general manager colleagues. So yes, I think management qualifications can help with delivering H&S, and help H&S practitioners engage with their colleagues, and hence get taken more serioulsy; it's a way out of the pigeon hole (you know, pigeons don't live in holes, that's Owls, or Woodpeckers),

John
David Bannister  
#6 Posted : 28 October 2009 17:40:46(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
David Bannister

I think that this question is one that has the "it depends" answer. A safety professional who manages should have knowledge and competence in management issues whereas one who is involved in a specialist area of H&S may have no need of such skills.

Thus a machine guarding specialist does not necessarily need to know about budgeting and employment law whilst a consultant who offers advice and guidance on setting up a safety management system should have a very good understanding of what management is and how it is applied to the H&S world.
katana-hseq  
#7 Posted : 28 October 2009 18:38:10(UTC)
Rank: New forum user
katana-hseq

I would say that a safety professional who has management qualifications has the advantage of understanding general business process and procedures. I came from a management background at diploma level before entering the respected profession of H & S and have found that my former training and experience has been of immense help in developing my career.

DavidBrede  
#8 Posted : 28 October 2009 19:34:09(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
DavidBrede

Certainly it has worked for me.

I find that having an MBA does give me a rounded view of an organisation and so you can see other points of view even if you do not agree with it.

I can also couch my arguments in ways that are appreciated better by other management professionals
ang  
#9 Posted : 29 October 2009 09:25:31(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
ang

I think it is a good idea, but not necessarily essential. I have been known as a manager for the last 21 years but without any relevant qualifications - most managers at our place have grown up with the organisation and moved into the management role as a progression without any management training. Some people fit in naturally but I do think some people need coaching and guidance on what it means to be a manager.

When we were making redundancies a while back I decided to got for L4 NVQ in Management - purely so I can show my competence in this area through a qualification. Can't say I leaned much, except that I now have lots of evidence and a piece of paper to say that I know what I am talking about - not sure it makes me a better manager though.

To summarise yes, I think Management skills are important in delivering health & safety however you come by these.

Ang.



Invictus  
#10 Posted : 29 October 2009 09:32:46(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Invictus

I don't think that we need management qualifications, you do however require strong interpersonnal skills. Why do you need to understand the business to get the safety message across?
Garfield Esq  
#11 Posted : 29 October 2009 09:48:41(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Garfield Esq

Adrian wrote:
Do you think that the Safety Professional should have a management qualification. The reason being, with soley H&S qualifications the H&S professional gets "pidgeon holed" as a specialist and sometimes does not get the recognition that they are part of the "management" team. With a management qualification it would give the H&S Professional an overall view of how a company is run. Apologies if this sounds long winded. I look forward to your responses.


Interesting question, just to mix it up a wee bit. Are we all aware of what 'formal quals' the management team have! Using my experience as a guide, not very much. But does this mean bad or incompetent management practices...

TBH I don't think that we need to know 'how the company is run' in all aspects, but do require an insight into how the company intends to run the business safely. This is all about adopting good communication practices and liasing between departments such as HR and Finance etc. I would recommend that all 'management team' members are provided management level HS training and of course training in their own disipline as appropriate. The days of hiding away the HS people should be consigned to the dark past.

BTW has the spell check gone!

Gary
jwk  
#12 Posted : 29 October 2009 11:26:43(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
jwk

Gary,

I know that in my outfit a large proportion of the senior management team have formal qualifications such as DMS or MBA, but in any event H&S is often about management. After all, we are urged to work to management systems, and I think it helps to study, for example, management systems, why they work and why they don't. It can help develop a certain healthy and focussed scepticism. Spill chock would be useful,

John
Steve Granger  
#13 Posted : 30 October 2009 15:36:43(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Steve Granger

Blossomway; your MBA will undoubtedly give you more insight but it may be a bit too general to say that 'I can also couch my arguments in ways that are appreciated better by other management professionals' .
Does this imply that without and MBA I cannot
I huv bean mostly suchseful so fur an I unerstand bizniz as i uwn one....
Sarcastic Steve
Anglin30064  
#14 Posted : 30 October 2009 16:33:16(UTC)
Rank: New forum user
Anglin30064

Yes - I think that it is very important that we have a reasonable level of management and commercial experience, although not necessarily a qualification.
It is important that we understand the commercial aspects of the company that we are involved with in order to implement our advice in light of the constraints that the commercial management have imposed upon them.
For my part I get involved in the H+S aspects of Corporate Governance and it is therefore essential that I be able to relate to directors on all levels of risk, including commercial and financial because they have a bearing on the imlpementation of H+S Management.

It also negates our "anorak" image !!!!!!!

Colin Anglin
Users browsing this topic
Guest
You cannot post new topics in this forum.
You cannot reply to topics in this forum.
You cannot delete your posts in this forum.
You cannot edit your posts in this forum.
You cannot create polls in this forum.
You cannot vote in polls in this forum.