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allanwood  
#1 Posted : 09 December 2010 15:44:57(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
allanwood

Our company on occasion has to cut masonry products whilst on site, we have looked at several ways of combating this including off site cutting, clipper saws usage in controled cutting zones/areas, the use of block splitters, and finally the use of stihl saws fitted with suppression kits (as a last resort). please note:- we have recently managed to complete projects where we have not used a stihl saw at all. wherever and whenever we wet cut we also ensure that the operative is face fit tested and wears an FFP2V filter mask, a single operative will possible cut no more that 6-8 blocks per day, and due to the suppression kit there is only a small amount of dust generated over a period of approximately 20 minutes. I am aware that the HSE guidance is now stating that FFP3 filter masks should be used when cutting silica based products but to me this seems a little excessive given that we are wet cutting and that cutting does not take place for prolonged periods, or do we need to upgrade the RPE that we are providing our operatives with? thanks in advance AL
AdrianHirst  
#2 Posted : 09 December 2010 16:15:09(UTC)
Rank: New forum user
AdrianHirst

The answer to the question of which RPE to use can only really be answered if you have some measured exposure data. As you haven't mentioned measurements I assume you don't have any? Without measurements it is difficult to argue against the HSE guidance for FFP3 masks. If you did have the data and could demonstrate that your FFP2 controls exposure to below the WEL for silica then you would probably be okay to continue. Adrian
allanwood  
#3 Posted : 09 December 2010 16:21:29(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
allanwood

thanks for the comments adrian, we have not undertaken any measurements, however the cutting is undertaken outdoors in well ventilated areas and as already mentioned the cutting takes place only for short duration AL
firesafety101  
#4 Posted : 09 December 2010 16:25:17(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
firesafety101

So your assessment is for silica dust but you suppress so the dust is removed therefore no exposure to dust - is that correct? If so do you still need rpe for dust when there is none? How confident are you that there is no exposure to the dust? How much does the rpe cost - £15. or so for ten? Is that not worth the extra protection?
freelance safety  
#5 Posted : 09 December 2010 16:27:47(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
freelance safety

Allan, difficult to argue with HSE guidance and information without being able to quantify a reasonable approach based on accurate scientific data. As many already know silica is a fibrogenic dust (as is asbestos) which can cause pronounced fibrogenic reaction resulting in scars in the lung tissue and obvious disease (such as silicosis). I assume that you have a copy of MDHS101: Crystalline Silica in Respirable Airborne Dusts? If not get a copy. Also checkout a free HSE document: www.hse.gov.uk/pubns/guidance/g404.pdf Or contact me direct and I'll see if I can assist.
Gary2468  
#6 Posted : 09 December 2010 19:08:53(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Gary2468

Going through the same scenario. Also refer to this HSE publication "Time to Clear the Air" - www.hse.gov.uk/pubns/misc830.pdf This makes it clear that you should be using water suppression with a minimum flow rate of 0.5 litre/min PLUS RPE with an Assigned Protection Factor (APF) of 10, even when using water suppression. We have opted for the P3 dust filters with an APF of 10, even though our previous P2 dust filters had the same APF! The HSE enforcement policy on this would appear to be: PN - no control measures (no water suppression, LEV or RPE PN - ineffective control measures (eg weak water flow, RPE badly worn/incorrect APF, no face fit IN - no or ineffective water suppression or LEV but effective & suitable RPE IN - effective water suppression / LEV but no suitable & effective RPE Regards
allanwood  
#7 Posted : 09 December 2010 21:53:42(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
allanwood

Thanks for that Gary2468 nice to see that i am not on my own with this issue. our FFP2V face filtering masks have an APF of 10 however on the latest HSE guidance its states that FFP3 should be used with an APF of 20
Gary2468  
#8 Posted : 10 December 2010 12:32:12(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Gary2468

Allan I stand corrected. The latest guidance does state 20. (and thankfully (after a quick check) the P3 filters we use have an APF of 20. phew!) The two links www.hse.gov.uk/pubns/misc830.pdf & http://www.hse.gov.uk/pubns/cis54.pdf are identical but for the difference in APF. CIS54 being the most recent publication. Does seem strange that even though you can technically achieve perfect dust suppression with water they are still insisting on resorting to the last line of defence. regards
freelance safety  
#9 Posted : 10 December 2010 12:35:20(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
freelance safety

Q. Gary, How do you know that you have technically achieved perfect dust suppression with water?
Gary2468  
#10 Posted : 10 December 2010 14:12:54(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Gary2468

By flooding the cutting tool, in this case a a diamond blade with water from the mains rather than using the small preesurised water pumps and carrying out air sampling. No dust, just a very wet pair of waterproof overalls.
freelance safety  
#11 Posted : 10 December 2010 14:45:18(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
freelance safety

Hi Gary, I’m glad you mention sampling. In most cases it is feasible to control respirable silica by dust suppression techniques or local exhaust ventilation. I’m sure most of us are aware of the exposure to RCS which has many adverse health effects including silicosis, chronic obstructive pulmonary disease (COPD), lung cancer and other connective tissue disorders. I assume that this analytical sampling is carried out by a competent person and that where workers may be regularly exposed to respirable crystalline silica levels greater than 0.1 g/m3, 8-hour TWA, then health surveillance including a respiratory questionnaire, lung function testing and chest X-rays are provided. The reason for mentioning this is about location (i.e. indoors/outdoors) of the task and treatment of waste water/dust particles. On many occasions this is overlooked and particulates within water are released and once dried can become airborne. This is very often forgotten about and sampling is generally done for the task only with very little in the way of reviewing post-task.
descarte8  
#12 Posted : 10 December 2010 15:20:28(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
descarte8

Useful links: http://www.hse.gov.uk/pubns/priced/eh75-4.pdf I believe discusses issues of wetting and how beneficial it is, and that it is unlikely to be 100% effective, therefore RPE is likely to be required as an extra precaution. As always you dont have to go with the advice that the HSE provides e.g. P3. But if you don't you better have some reason / data to back up your decision (monitoring results for example) Des
freelance safety  
#13 Posted : 10 December 2010 15:30:27(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
freelance safety

Descarte8, you are quite correct it is not a 100% effective solution – which is why I asked Gary the question on how he perceives he has achieved this. Monitoring must be carried out by competent professionals (i.e. occupational hygienists) and backed up by scientific data, this may include some health screening. Another good document relating to this subject can be obtained free from HSE: rr827(1) (health surveillance in silica exposed workers).
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