At the bottom off the pile in the current climate and at the forefront when the brown stuff hits the rotating object?? I'll get my coat.

Do we need guidance from organisations such as HSE on this? Risk Management, whether H & S or Corporate should sit at the heart of business decisions in all areas. I believe we have to move on from negative comments regarding 'the current climate'...

directly working for the MD along side finance and legal -----there is no other spot in my view; but this example is in the ideal world!

quote=bob youel]directly working for the MD along side finance and legal -----there is no other spot in my view; but this example is in the ideal world!

1st point
http://www.hse.gov.uk/pubns/priced/hsg65.pdf

2nd
Covered by all above... it depends :)

WOW Yossarian toooooooooo much for me on a Wednesday

Personal view - having audited all sorts of organisations, I'm not sure there is a definitive answer to the question, and the best is probably - it depends on the organisation and what works best for it. Putting the h&s function in HR can give it an independence, but at the risk of isolating it. Putting it in operations or facilities can align it with the major risks of the organisation and better ensure that these are addressed, but with the risk of sidelining other parts of the organisation. As long as you are aware of the potential opportunities and problems of where you put the h&s function, you can organise matters accordingly to maximise its effectiveness and minimise the disadvantages. Selecting the right people to do this is of course a key part of the picture.

Hi All,
My roles are varied as are many health and safety professionals, I list OH&S, HR, quality, training design and Environmental management.

I have an Operations director as my immediate line manager for Health and safety, another operations Director for Quality management, oh and the Managing Director as a back up.

The board between them insist that they are all responsible for health and safety (as a unit) but have made me the Top management appointed person??? None of them have any form of qualification in any of my areas of expertise.

Luckily enough I am self motivated and get the message across but it is hard work.

Interesting means of measurement, and not without some merit. I once worked for a company as a national safety manager, reporting directly to the MD, but was given the same company car as the sales reps. Mixed messages?

If, as many organisations would have you believe, safety is their no.1 priority, then h&s should sit right at the top and the senior safety person should report directly to the MD or CEO. Meanwhile, in the real world h&s sits in may different positions, partly dependant on the size and industry sector of the organisation. I wonder if those in finance or HR ask where their outfit sits in the company - I doubt it?

As said already above, I think where H&S sits within an organisation reflects the importance that H&S is given within the organisation.
If you are given a position where you can influence what happens (maybe through your line management)then H&S matters if you are given a position where you or your line management have no influence then the company is IMHO paying lip service.
My last organisation my boss (Head of H&S) reported direct to the CEO, I looked after another site and was part of the senior management team of that site but independent of the rest of the management team.
This seemed to give me a neutral position as far as the workforce/union were concerned and it worked for me.
The downside was that sometimes (not often) other managers went behind my back to my boss when they felt I was costing money/obstructive/unhelpful/stopping what they wanted. My boss would ring, I would present my business case and we would go from there.
With the recent Corporate Manslaughter verdict perhaps the executive & board may be slightly less inclined tto label H&S as a costly unwanted necessity?

Take Care