Posted By Helen C Morning all. Can anyone give me the official definition of reasonably foreseeable and where it comes from? Cheers

Posted By Helen C wow, thanks. Off to find my dictionary!

Posted By jom Helen, I doubt you will find an official definition. If the phrase appears in your Act, then see if the act contains a definition. It's juries and judges who determine what was reasonably foreseeable in specific instances. John.

Posted By Chris Packham You might also want to look at the following website: www.cre.gov.uk/publs/con...04sp_foreseeability.html Whilst not specifically relating to a health and safety issue the court decision could, according to my conversation with legal people, impact on health and safety issues. Chris

Posted By Raymond Rapp Helen The legal concept of 'reasonably foreseeable' stems from Section 40 HSWA - Onus of proving limits of what is practicable etc. The case law for s40 defence was determined by what can be deemed to be reasonably foreseeable. Ray

Posted By Raymond Rapp The request was for the 'official definition' and therefore the question lends itself to a technical answer. Whether a set of circumstances are deemed to be 'reasonably foreseeable' will be determined by the Court and not any other subjective process. The concept of foreseeability in accidents has been discussed at length by academics etc. Some observers suggest that certain accidents and disasters are indeed foreseeable. Whereas Wildavsky argues that they are only foreseeable with the benefit of of hindsight. I suspect the truth lies somewhere between the two polarised notions. Ray

Posted By holmezy Helen, can't quite remember the exact definition, but a confined space is somewhere where there is a risk of oxygen depletion, where the size or shape of the space inhibits movement, access and egress, where rescue from the space would be difficult, or where fluids (either solids or liquids) could move or bocome unstable and envelope someone. Excess heat or cold should also be considered. Or I might just be guessing, but its something like that. So, if you enter a grain silo, the entance is usually via a small door at the top, the air will be dusty, it will probably be warm, there may be gases present that deplete the oxygen, the grain will be unstable and you could feasible drown in it, rescue will be difficult, so its reasonably foreseeable that an accident could happen. Whether or not you could pass out is not the definition of a confined space, but is one of the considerations when designating a confined space. Again, sorry about the grammar and its probably not the best explanation, but I think I know what I meant!! Holmezy

Posted By holmezy Helen, Curiosity got the better of me so I looked it up on the HSE website, and I know you wernt looking for a definition!! Confined Spaces at work A confined space is a place which is substantially enclosed (though not always entirely), and where serious injury can occur from hazardous substances or conditions within the space or nearby (e.g. lack of oxygen). Technically you are probably both wrong or a bit right in your "unconcious" arguement. Holmezy

Posted By Helen C sorry, overlap in posts there.

Posted By holmezy Ray, sort of agree with most of your comment, however, risk is a factor of liklehood and severity, but I agree its an informed judgement. Reasonably forseeable; if we have a confined space, a large old water tank for instance, that has a small sealable entrance, and has an amount of stagnant liquid in it, and the liquid is giving off toxic gases, then its RF that A)someone may should the door and the worker suffocates, B)even with the door open, oxygen may deplete and the worker suffocates C)the worker may pass out from heat exhaustion, D)the worker may collapse and drown, E) worker may trip and fall etc etc What would not be RF would be that there is a sudden downpour of rain, the work site floods, the floods dislodge the water tank from its supports, the tank then floats and the current then takes the tank into open waters and as the worker is trying to escape, he is eaten by a shark! or something equally odd! So, again, just because there may be a risk of unconciousnees, does not necesarily make it a confined space, there are other factors to consider. TGI Friday..... Holmezy

Posted By Helen C thanks all.