I used stilts (and fallen off of them) for a number of years when installing ceilings whilst working in the house refurb game.

I also used to walk on steel "I" beams 100ft above the concrete with no support and no harness whilst carrying steam valves on boilers in a power station. Would I do either now? Not a chance. Times change and so does the awareness that life is too short to put ourselves at risk for a few extra pennies.

Falls from height accounts for some 28% of workplace fatalities and we are still messing about with this stuff?? Sorry but I find this both incredible and rediculous.

Are stilts really safe or has C&G Plastering just been really lucky or are there falls they have had that have not been reported??

There are low level MEWPs (Nano SP as an example) that can be driven through standard sized doorways and drive whilst elevated and take up not much more room than a guy on stilts and one heck of a lot safer. The reason a lot of people don't want to use them is the cost of hiring them, typically £50 per week. Shame.

Sorry if you misunderstand me Stiltman, I wasn't suggesting there have been any fatalities from people falling off stilts, tbh I don't know if there have or not but the POTENTIAL is very real.

(http://www.hse.gov.uk/shatteredlives/)

I do believe though that there have been many more accidents where people have fallen over while using them (me for one) and these have not been reported.

I would not call the integrity of C&G into question either as I have no knowlege of or experience with them but I do know from experience that a lot of the incidents that don't result in significant harm to people goes unreported.

I also know from my former employers' customer base that a lot of people do use MEWPs for this work but obviously this is not always going to be a viable option.

You have already mentioned false floors in a previous post and now machine plastering (though I have never seen it done) so there are other options, even if the job takes longer or costs more.

My main point is just because a method is fast, cheap and everybody does it doesn't mean it is safe and neither does it mean that it should continue.

Originally Posted by: Stiltman

Originally Posted by: Charlie Brown

...Falls from height accounts for some 28% of workplace fatalities and we are still messing about with this stuff?? Sorry but I find this both incredible and rediculous.

Are stilts really safe or has C&G Plastering just been really lucky or are there falls they have had that have not been reported??...

In 22 years I've not come across any fatalities amongst the plasterers working at ceiling height indoors. None. Similarly C & G Plastering are a reputable contractor - why not ask them if you don't believe the numbers?

And I've not spoken to any spreads working off MEWP - it may happen but I struggle to see how they could do the job in good time whilst moving that rig into position for each 'reach'. And where do you put the spot board?

In the meantime there will be site workers (somewhere) using a scaffold board placed over two crates as access equipment.

Maybe machine plaster is the answer? Do it all from ground level and use long handled floats.

Originally Posted by: Charlie Brown

I do believe though that there have been many more accidents where people have fallen over while using them (me for one) and these have not been reported.

I would not call the integrity of C&G into question either as I have no knowlege of or experience with them but I do know from experience that a lot of the incidents that don't result in significant harm to people goes unreported.

Sorry Charlie but, if you and colleagues/ associates of yours are not reporting these injuries then you are part of the problem.

No it isn't our job to eliminate every potential hazard but it is our job to manage risk. We do this by using tools such as heirarchy of controls. In this case the top contorl is "Avoid working at height if possible" Is it possible to avoid working at height in this instance? We have already established that it is.

Originally Posted by: achrn

Originally Posted by: Charlie Brown

Sorry if you misunderstand me Stiltman, I wasn't suggesting there have been any fatalities from people falling off stilts, tbh I don't know if there have or not but the POTENTIAL is very real.

The POTENTIAL for fatalities is not what we are about though, is it.   

People die from falling down stairs, but we don't ban stairs in the workplace.  People choke on food, but we don't ban eating in the workplace.  It's not the job of H&S to eliminate every potential hazard, or even every potential fatal hazard. 

Once again, it seems this thread has descended to the level of "stands to reason they're dangerous, dunnit".

Originally Posted by: Charlie Brown

No it isn't our job to eliminate every potential hazard but it is our job to manage risk. We do this by using tools such as heirarchy of controls. In this case the top contorl is "Avoid working at height if possible" Is it possible to avoid working at height in this instance? We have already established that it is.

CB I get that you are now better equipped to understand risk, and agree that prevention is better than a cure.

What I dispute is the ends justifying the means when it comes to achieving the flat surface demanded by clients. Machine plastering is advancing, but, there is still a requirement for some touching up and remedials where somebody has to get up close and personal.

The best finish is still applied by hand using a trowel/float. The client demands the best. The designer likes a flat finish. The decorator will love a flat surface. It all adds up to a good job delivered to spec.

Until every plasterer uses MEWP or 'somebody' installs false floors the industry (approx. 5000 bods) will be negotiating the use of towers/podiums/hop ups/boards or looking for a 7ft plasterer. In every case you use static bases the plasterer is going to over reach if he sees a bit he can just stretch to get finished - that is a risk you can eliminate today by using stilts.

Would the trade pay for MEWP or false floors? Not likely in my humble opinion.

There is another HSE question and answer about stilts here:

https://webcommunities.hse.gov.uk/connect.ti/workheight/view?objectId=13683

At the end of the day, you need to complete a risk assessment.  Look at the floor, ceiling height, what other provisions can be made for safety for the job being undertaken and document it.  I think in some cases stilts, which the plasterer is familiar with are safer that a platform that he has to keep moving around to do the job, especially if the platform is a pop up type without rails.  On the other hand, it the whole area can achieve the correct height using MEWPs or other sophisticated equipment then this will be the safer option.

There is no ban on the use of stilts as long as you can justify that that is the safest method taking into account the competence of the worker and the other work at height provisions you can put in place.

Hapy New Year to all...

I have come across this thread quite late as I have only recently become involved with advising some companies who undertake drylining and plastering, and some of whose Operatives use stilts on an almost daily basis. I same 'some of' because there are some people who don't have the confidence (or physical capability) to use stilts and so they are generally working off  hop-ups or podium steps, and generally doing the plastering of walls rather than ceilings - but for access to higher ceilings, stilts are commonly used, and in conversation with the Operatives they often say that they feel more comfortable on stilts and they feel they can produce a beter job when working on them.

I realise that's no answer in the event of a fall, but the point I want to make is that these drylining companies are working on construction sites under the auspices of a PC, who will approve the contractors RAMS before work commences, and so the PC's H&S team must also be happy with the RAMS to allow the work to be done in that way. I have yet to come across a site on which such activities are prohibited - not forgetting that it's not just plasterers that use stilts, but they are also commonly used in cieling installation work as well.

I know the thread has covered the issue of better, more safe, access methods, but that hasn't always taken into account the issue of getting other types of access equipment to the work area, which may be on upper levels.

The issue of competency has also been raised, but as there are no 'safe use of stilts' training courses (at least I can't find details of any) how can competency be judged? We are almost going back to grandfather rights, and it gets even harder when you factor in that in (probably) the majority of cases today, the Operatives are from various parts of the EU, and are not just British.

I also note that someone made reference to the 'bags of plaster they lug around'...not in my experience! They have the plaster prepared for them by a labourer and it is brought to the point of work for them. Since they are generally paid on a sq/m rate, they dont want to have to stop for any reason!

My approach is to review the RAMS for the work and question why stilts have been arrived at as the method for doing the work; and then duirng any walkround, make of a point of looking at floor surfaces and housekeeping standards to ensure floors are being kept clear of obstructions. It is also imperative that communication with other contractors is maintained so that they don't litter the place with trip hazards. In this way I can judge whether my client is doing everything reasonable to manage the hazards and risks.

Originally Posted by: allanwood

Hi Lisa I personnally do not have a problem with this type of equipment, and we regularly have plasterers on our sites whom use stilts and have done so for many years without incident. As long as the guy has recieved information, instruction & training on the safe use of his stilts and the work area is kept clean & tidy by utilising a clean as you go approach you shouldnt have any problems.

I always prefer an approach like this. Look, at the end f the day if somene can use stilts while doing an incredbibly skilled job like plastering then they are "qualified" enough. If they fall refer the "NO WIN NO FEE" agent to the RAMS you have done and tell em to do one.