It comes down to effective compartmentation and a) the distance to a place of relative safety and b) the distance to a place of absolute safety (that is, outside the building and away from the fire). A large single room would have different risks to two smaller spaces with effective fire separation. So as a start, are there two doors at reception leading into different spaces?

John

I'm with you Little beeches, I'm struggling to think of a single premises that I know of where 180 people work that only has one way in and out regardless of compartmentation etc.

If a landlord has a FRA for the site it's probably either for his own purposes as an vacant rental or completed by a previous occupier, you'd need to do your own to cover your own circumstances and arrangements once you occupy - and what then if you conclude a single exit is insufficient?

When looking to take on new sites, like you I'll be drafting a FRA in my head as I view.

Thanks Ziggy,

Well, that clears that up: on two floors with 180 people you will almost certainly need two escape routes. Don't go down the escape ladder route (no pun intended), fire services don't like them and they're not really practical, especially given an ageing working population. A fixed escape stairway is what I would seriously consider,

John

Littlebreeches, I work for an organisation that is the Landlord on our current site. the line taken is similar to that you descrbe, but it is in the rental contract that we are responsible for communual areas and facilities as well as infrastructure which include external fire escapes and route.

It may be that this landlord is reasoning that by not having fire escapes he is not responsible for their upkeep.  I know this is nonsense but it never ceases to surprise me how ignorant some bodies are of basic building safety, let only the finer points of Fire safety.

Originally Posted by: jwk

Thanks Ziggy,

Well, that clears that up: on two floors with 180 people you will almost certainly need two escape routes. Don't go down the escape ladder route (no pun intended), fire services don't like them and they're not really practical, especially given an ageing working population. A fixed escape stairway is what I would seriously consider,

John

Indeed, if you are seriously considering a ladder (either roll-out or the cantilever sort), I'd recommend having a go with one first then imagine trying to get your staff down one in an emergency situation..... definitely better than jumping out of the window but not really by a great margin!

I had a go with the roll out type a few years back when we found one in a store room and I couldn't resist it (yes I know....) anyhow no way would I want to be trying to get any number of frightened office workers down one.

Edited by user 29 March 2019 15:00:58(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

I would suggest that a competent person undertake a pre-occupancy fire risk assessment. From the scenario above the building could still be considered compliant even with a single fire exit (there are a number of unknowns). I agree it would be better to have more (although a second exit would be discounted when carrying out occupancy calculation).

A number of elements can come into play, for instance:

If the original building file is available (should have this but often don't) then it will give an indication of the standard it was built to. Let's say it was built to ADB, then an exit width of 1050mm allows me a maximum of 220 persons.

From DCLG guide for offices :"At least two exits should be provided if a room/area is to be occupied by more than 60 persons. This number of 60 can be varied in proportion to the risk; for a lower risk there can be a slight increase, for a higher risk, lower numbers of persons should be allowed." The DCLG does give different exit capacity numbers depending on risk profile as well.

There is some wiggle room in terms of definition of area. Again the scenario above could be deemed to be compliant.

Would expect travel distance to a protected stairway enclosure/final exit/separate fire compartment to be around 18m. 

As Messy says, ladders would not be acceptable for this scenario.

Ultimately if the organisation is unhappy with provisions they do not have to enter into a rental agreement.

Thank you all for responding to this question. My client has decided that they are happy to accept the risk on face value. However I have pushed for a formal 3rd party fire risk assessment to be carried out, to allay my concerns.

Further investigations my end also confirmed that roll out escape ladder are no longer considered viable. Landlord has yet to sanction an alternative fire escape, so I will look forward to receiving the assessment report that I can use to support any remedial works.

Edited by user 24 April 2019 15:50:45(UTC)  | Reason: Spelling