That sounds dangerous. If it can kill viruses, what will it do to micro-biomes on a perosn? How do they ensure the person is completely doused? Do they have to strip and their clothes are done separately? Do they remove people from wheelchairs, so that these can be sanitised?

Just reminds me of spain bleaching their beaches at the beginning of the pandemic.

i was intrigued so looked it up.

https://saniarch.co.uk/

so comes with a pruduct passed by Cosmetic Products (safety) Regulations 2008, why on earth would you use those regulations? Would it bot pass the safety regulations as a Biocide?

https://www.hse.gov.uk/coronavirus/disinfecting-premises-during-coronavirus-outbreak.htm

Do not spray people with disinfectants

Do not spray people with disinfectants (in a tunnel, cabinet, or chamber) under any circumstances. Spraying a person could be harmful and does not reduce the spread of the virus. This is because transmission is usually through droplets or contact. 

Attempting to disinfect someone in a disinfection system or device has no impact on the spread of the virus because droplets are created when people talk, cough or sneeze.

Originally Posted by: Brian Hagyard

a product passed by Cosmetic Products (safety) Regulations 2008, why on earth would you use those regulations? Would it not pass the safety regulations as a Biocide?

If it has biocidal claims then it should be approved by the HSE as such, however the active agent would never be approved for human contact in this manner.

A lot of substances that used to be "approved" for leave on application as cosmetic products have long since been removed.

Once again snake oil salesmen pandering to the "need to be seen to be doing something" brigade.

Why not set up a sheep dip to dunk residents and visitors in?

I can understand why the guidance is 'don't do it, folks'. The last thing we want is for people to (a) use non-prescribed chemicals in the disinfecting chambers and (b) making their own.

Quaternary ammonium compounds include things like benzalkonium chloride which is found a lot in antibac surface cleaners and, more recently, alcohol-free disinfectants/sanitisers.

Not too terrible stuff and can be used in very small quantities with reasonable efficacy. I'd imagine if you wore goggles and a mask and were to walk through a reasonably large-droplet stream that it wouldn't be fine enough to permeate that and therefore be breathed in. It's used in detergents, as a preservative, in antiseptic mouthwashes and lozenges... it's surprisingly common stuff.

As for the 'how does it disinfect ALL of you' scenario, if you're disinfecting the outermost surface and you wash your hands and disinfect your hands regularly, then you're still at reduced risk as it's not persisting on bits of clothing/skin that you're not typically washing/sanitising.

The mention of cosmetic products regulations (CPR) is a strange one for me - if it's a biocide, and marketed as such, then this essentially supercedes is being classified as a cosmetic and therefore out of scope for CPR and instead must conform to biocidal products regulations (BPR). The exception for that is if it is marketed as a cosmetic at which point making disinfectant claims, especially 'kills viruses' type claims, are prohibited.

Originally Posted by: Benz3ne

I can understand why the guidance is 'don't do it, folks'. The last thing we want is for people to (a) use non-prescribed chemicals in the disinfecting chambers and (b) making their own.

Quaternary ammonium compounds include things like benzalkonium chloride which is found a lot in antibac surface cleaners and, more recently, alcohol-free disinfectants/sanitisers.

Not too terrible stuff and can be used in very small quantities with reasonable efficacy. I'd imagine if you wore goggles and a mask and were to walk through a reasonably large-droplet stream that it wouldn't be fine enough to permeate that and therefore be breathed in. It's used in detergents, as a preservative, in antiseptic mouthwashes and lozenges... it's surprisingly common stuff.

As for the 'how does it disinfect ALL of you' scenario, if you're disinfecting the outermost surface and you wash your hands and disinfect your hands regularly, then you're still at reduced risk as it's not persisting on bits of clothing/skin that you're not typically washing/sanitising.

The mention of cosmetic products regulations (CPR) is a strange one for me - if it's a biocide, and marketed as such, then this essentially supercedes is being classified as a cosmetic and therefore out of scope for CPR and instead must conform to biocidal products regulations (BPR). The exception for that is if it is marketed as a cosmetic at which point making disinfectant claims, especially 'kills viruses' type claims, are prohibited.

Ergo, cosmetics it is. 

That's not to say it isn't efficacious - the company producing is still welcome to have them tested to EN1500/EN13727/EN1276, etc. ad infinitum (almost).

biosafety theatre still lives! it even gets you a mention in the local press as  a caring sharing sort of place!

On no it doesn’t oh yes it does…

OK why spray a whole fully clothed and possibly vulnerable person with something that might only kill covid 19 and might cause the respiratory and dermatitis issues when the problem is getting the virus up you nose either by inhalation or putting contaminated fingers up said nose?

Waste  of disinfectants/waste of money

Unnecessary risk to health

Possible environmental impact.

The EU addressed such issues back in November 

https://ec.europa.eu/growth/sectors/cosmetics/products/borderline-products_en

Basically trying to head off the disreputable trader

So far 16000 people in the county have stepped through the arches in care homes, factories and play centres”

This clearly indicates its intended use is at establishments other than just care homes. This escalates the seriousness of the situation and reinforces my view that it should urgently be brought to the attention of ALL health & safety agencies. Due to the use of a HSE proforma reporting form and bureaucracy so far I failed to properly bring the matter to the HSE’s urgent attention.

I therefore hope that the Kent Director of Public Health and my professional colleagues at Mid Kent’s environmental health departments/sections will help here as contacting the HSE directly is not easy

Originally Posted by: Brian Hagyard

thanks Roundtuit interesting read and as suspected not approved for use in this way - shame we dont have enough tradeing standards or health and Safety inspectors to deal with issues like this. Still getting collegues wanting to use UV or temperature checks on our entrance ways or fog the building every day - just down to something they have read on facebook!

These things are kicking around in a few places and the supplier is quite keen on challenging the HSE advice with lots of words and pictures that, ultimately, don't mean anything. I'm being somewhat facetious but it was akin to evidence that spraying the chemical in question on your feet to reduce bacterial count was an approved use with no significant side effects and therefore spraying it around your respiratory system would be just fine.

The last place we had that had invested in one was given short shrift over what would happen should they start to use it although since it was a nightclub they've not really had much of a chance... 

What is interesting is to conduct an internet search on a named product or provider and travel back through their electronic foot prints left on the internet to see how their marketing claims adjust over time to in order to leave themselves less exposed to any HSE/Trading Standards intervention.

Edited by user 17 December 2020 11:41:41(UTC)  | Reason: FFS