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SID66  
#1 Posted : 06 September 2022 08:34:55(UTC)
Rank: New forum user
SID66

We have had an ongoing issue for many years when asking staff to report AAW in a timeous manner so that they can be investigated in that same timeous manner whilst all details are fresh in the mind of all those involved (IP, witness statements and evidence from site/location etc). Some AAW have been submitted 6-8 months after the event with no one knowing of it or reporting it other than the IP.  So i am looking for some information or experience of defining a timescale for submission of an AAW in the workplace (outwith RIDDOR reporting requiremens) which will allow us to carry out any investigation in a timeous manner and not carry out one some 6-8 months after the event when minds are not focused and evidence and CCTV is no longer available?  

A Kurdziel  
#2 Posted : 06 September 2022 08:47:17(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
A Kurdziel

Why the reluctance to report? Is it because the process is clunky and takes for ever to complete? Is it because local managers have been told(incentivised) to keep accident reports low? As you say reporting an incident months after it has happened is fairly pointless, but you really need to find out why it is being delayed. Most people who have been involved in a incident want to get it off the chest as quickly as possible, and not delay. I assume that the IP report it themselves?

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SID66 on 07/09/2022(UTC)
Evans38004  
#3 Posted : 06 September 2022 13:00:11(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Evans38004

We normally operate on the basis that an incident / injury must be reported before the end of the shift, or in the first 2 hours of the next shift worked. Failure to do so, may be result in others being harmed in a similar circumstances during the interim perdiod and the company / insurance may conclude that the injury was not work related

Minor incident investigation should be investigated within 14 days & more serious incidents have a deadline of 1 calendar month.

 

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SID66 on 07/09/2022(UTC)
peter gotch  
#4 Posted : 06 September 2022 15:43:00(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
peter gotch

Hi Sid

There are two slightly separated issues here.

1. Getting the report quickly.

2 Deciding how long the investigation should take.

The first should be relatively easy. Make sure that there is a very clear policy that is not wholly reliant on the victim who may be likely to have other things than reporting on their mind.

The second is MUCH more difficult. I would be wary of setting over prescriptive timetables for completing investigations of WHATEVER severity.

There are going to be some very serious accidents where the investigation can be effectively completed very quickly.

Equally there could be an incident with a minor outcome but which is a precursor event for something much more serious and if you are going to do an effective root cause analysis it might take much longer than you write into some procedure, particularly if you need to bring in specialists to look at particular parts of the investigation.

If you define that all investigations are to be completed within say 2 weeks or a month, then you may simply block effective root cause investigation, so making it much more likely that the investigators will stop when they have identified some top level cause(s) usually an unsafe act. Meaning that the underlying unsafe conditions are not identified and it is those that you really need to find and sort out!

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SID66 on 07/09/2022(UTC)
pdhmobile  
#5 Posted : 07 September 2022 07:14:28(UTC)
Rank: New forum user
pdhmobile

Hi

To reiterate what has already been said, reporting of the incident should be ASAP to the supervisor who will evaluate if there is immediate danger to others or not and then the supervisor will report within 12 hrs to management, normally at shift handover.

Investigation wise, I would recommend against putting a strict deadline on them. By all means have a guide or a nice to have, say 2 weeks, but always with the option of extending that without repercussions to the investigation team.

All investigations are different and even with some of the 'minor' events, you might discover things that make the investigation more complex.

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SID66 on 07/09/2022(UTC)
SID66  
#6 Posted : 07 September 2022 12:25:45(UTC)
Rank: New forum user
SID66

Thank you all for your replies.

To place a bit of context on the original post - We had an incident whereby a employee was handling mail and issuing to individuals the employee then felt unwell and went home from work potentialy due to the content in the mail  (RA and SSoW in place for handling and issuing mail) No one reported this from the workplace (we actively and continuously promote the requirement to report all AAW) and only when the individual returned some 6 months later did he report it as an AAW (do we then record as NAAW as no evidence or supportive statements can be provided etc) Witness recollection lost, CCTV lost and Evidence lost?  I take on board all you say in your posts but how do you investigate and manage a thourough investigation after 6 months?  This is why I am thinking about a timescale for ivestigation or do we investigate and do the best we can with the information findings we have from the IP and let the legals sort this out - A PI claim will follow this incident? 

Thanks.

peter gotch  
#7 Posted : 07 September 2022 12:57:05(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
peter gotch

Hi Sid

You might or might not get a claim, but to support the claim the injured party would face similar difficulties to your organisation in terms of collating evidence.

The best you can probably do at this point is to gather what you can as part of a review of your procedures - which review might well conclude that there is no evidence available to indicate that change is needed.

P

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SID66 on 07/09/2022(UTC)
Evans38004  
#8 Posted : 07 September 2022 14:12:41(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Evans38004

IMHO

As Peter states, it will be difficult for the claimant to prove that the was any AAW / exposure & hence that there was an incident that warrants compensation.

If the employee has been away from work for 6 months, how come his line manager or HR have not queries his absence - if they have been in contact with the employee, the employee would have ample opportunity to inform the company & warn them of the incident / possible recurrence. 

It all souds pretty fishy to me...

PS - regarding my previous posting, those deadlines are merely targets and there is flexibility afforded to management / myself to review each incident on a case-by-case basis. The majority of the time we get the initial report and investigation completed well within these periods

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SID66 on 07/09/2022(UTC)
SID66  
#9 Posted : 07 September 2022 15:23:16(UTC)
Rank: New forum user
SID66

We have a strong and robust SMS operating with the nature of the game I am in. Accident reporting and investigation is very good in the main with return dates being submitted on time. However, some of these fishy reports shouldnt see the light of day.  Myself, Senior Managers and HR are regularly involved to try to manage this (painful area for me) as best we can.  We will continue keeping a watchful eye on it.

Thanks to all who have posted, your views, experiences and comments are appreciated.

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