IOSH forums home
»
Our public forums
»
OSH discussion forum
»
Safety People, titles and their professional use
Rank: Guest 
|
Posted By David Wallington
Hi gang just a little question re:
Safety People, titles and professional use.
Im just curious how many names companies can give to staff who manage safety in the work place.
Im have the title of, Occupational Safety and Health Officer/Fire Safety Officer.
How ever I seem to be misinterpreted as being my employers risk manager, a task I corrected with the Executive recently.
I deal specifically with occupational safety risk, not coporate, clinical, information, communications risks and so on.
Im am interested in what names the corporate world give to safety proffessionals out there. And if there is a perception of OSH being all emcompassing of every risk in industry.
OH its a laovely 24 degress celsius in sunny perth western australia today.
Gday to all in the homeland UK :)
Dave
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Guest
|
Posted By Richard Spencer
Dave
We can do better than that on the East Coast, we recorded 44 degrees C today Tuesday 30 Nov 04.
I am at home now following a refreshing dip in the pool and sitting in the Aircon sipping my first glass of Chardonnay – Margaret River of course.
Life is hard mate - what do they say "you've got one life, make the best of it".
C'mon all you poms we need your skills over here. UK emigration topped Asian migration for the first time since the demise of that hated SOB Paul Keating. So get your applications in.
Richard
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Guest
|
Posted By Ian Stone
Is that a job offer Richard???
Ian
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Guest
|
Posted By Merv Newman
My first title was Risk Management Coordinator, again only referring to HSE.
After that I was "Safety Engineer" which I wasn't. Then i was Manager, HSE department. Finished up as Safety Management Systems Consultant.
Right now I'm The Boss. (ok, Senior SMS consultant)
The French did a survey a few years back and came up with about 150 job titles for people doing what the english call, traditionally, "Safety Officer" (which I think is an ok title if you are in the forces, but is a bit off in civilian life)
Merv
It's a bit early for a glass right now, but come the evening I'll be on the terrace watching the sun go down with a glass of real jura chardonnay - they make it just up the road from here.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Guest
|
Posted By Mike Craven
In response to David's original question, titles are fairly meaningless - it's what's in the job description that matters. In the past couple of years, I've been Safety Officer, Health & Safety Manager, Health & Safety Adviser and Health & Safety Manager again with little change to what I actually do. The most recent change was a "regrade" from "Adviser" to "Manager", which was my employer and manager's way of raising the profile of health and safety! and justifying my successful request for a pay rise - and who I am to argue with that!
My job description hasn't changed too much, except that the position gets "talked-up" a bit more in the narrative, and I have line manager responsibility for the modern apprentice - having lost responsibility for the deleted post of Assistant H&S Adviser.
I think they sell Australian chardonnay at Sainsburys.
Mike
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Guest
|
Posted By Lisa Eldridge
some organisations -particularly smaller care/health establishments combine h&s as part of overall risk management. I am currently - get this for a long title - Health & safety & Quality manager - a bit of a mouthful really.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Guest
|
Posted By Merv Newman
If they ofer you QHSE (quality, Health, Safety and Environment) be careful you don't get the security guards as well.
Australian chardonnay is 2 for 1 at tescos this week. Great stuff, but needs thorough chilling.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Guest
|
Posted By Stuart Nagle
Dave.
I hope you get sunburnt - you git !!
Stuart
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Guest
|
Posted By Derek Rooney MIOSH MIIRSM
My current title is Health, Safety & Environment Officer after previously being co-ordinator, advisor & Manager (Personally titles don't mater to me)
What does matter is i'm freezing my b@lls off in glasgow & you gits are soaking up the sun.
Send me that application! You can keep your wine though.
Dez
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Guest
|
Posted By Raymond Rapp
Dave
I agree job titles can be confusing at times but more so for those who are unfamilar with h&s. Perhaps IOSH could establish a protocol for titles when they have sorted out their own members status and titles. On the other hand...My job title is really quite simple - Health and Safety Representative, 'cause I'm a TU rep.
Meanwhile, I would love to work 'down under' but the money is crap. Rather get a job in Dubai.
G'day
Ray
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Guest
|
Posted By Jeff
My intuitive response would be to say that if you call yourself a H&S 'Officer' you are putting yourself at risk of being regarded as being responsible for H&S.
But if you use the term H&S Advisor it properly describes the job role and, hopefully, shows employees and managers that yours is an advisory post only.
The term officer seems to me to be outdated and comes from the days pre '74 (and for 10/20 years afterwards) when the Safety Officer was perceived to be responsible for H&S.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Guest
|
Posted By Jack
Health and Safety Officer grates with me too. I don't think it infers that the post holder is 'responsible' for h&s though; I see it as a throw back to an internal enforcement role rather than an advisory one.
I have some concerns about 'Health and Safety Manager' too. There should be no problem with it if everyone perceived it to be the person who managed the h&s function. Unfortunately many perceive this role, too, to be the person responsible for h&s.
So I tend to also favour 'adviser'.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Guest
|
Posted By Don Harrison
We should have a prize for the longest or the daftest title. I would win on both counts. I'm currently "Responsible Care, Quality & Training Manager" I've even been "Responsible Care Process Owner" once, which was utterly meaningless. The Safety Advisors who work for used to be called "Responsible Care Facilitators" in our madly-named workplace. The joke is we almost called the scaffolders "Erection facilitators" but that has to be apocryphal. Doesn't it?
Don, Teesside
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Guest
|
Posted By Laurie
I started in the 80s as COSHH Advisor - believe it or not that is all I did - COSHH advice, assessment and training. The rest of H&S was looked after by a different guy, and we reported to different managers!
Then I became H&S Co-ordinator, then H&S Officer, then H&S Advisor and then back to H&S Officer.
About ten years ago there was some public discussion about the difference, if any, between the terms officer and advisor.
Legal opinion suggested that an "Officer" would be regarded as an officer of the company, and had certain legal responsibilities. An "Advisor" was just that, and whether people took the advice or not was their responsibility not his/hers.
Would be interesting to know if that legal opnion remains the same in 2004. I'm not aware of any case law precedent.
Laurie
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Guest
|
Posted By kevin reynolds
hi there.
I am currently struggling with an application for "safety and Risk manager" and what an employer expects as opposed to advertising for a safety officer,advisor,manager etc. any guidance appreciated.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Guest
|
Posted By Seth Pierce
At present my job title is: Health, Safety and Environmental Adivisor. Redcently added to this was Fire Safety Manager but due to business cards only being approx 85mm long we couldn't fit it all on.
If there's a job going in Austalia I'd be more than interested. I do have immediate family in Auz so obtaining a visa shouldn't be too much of a problem.
Seth
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Guest
|
Posted By John Mackessack
Mine's a bit different: Health & Safety Specialist. The jury is out on this one but I don't care what I'm called as long as it's not 'officer'.
Chilean Merlot for me tonight.
John
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Guest
|
Posted By J Knight
I've twice been an Adviser and am now a Manager. I don't object to the Manager bit, as I do manage the process here, and when people (inevitably) think that I'm the guy wot does the risk assessments I just tell them I'm not. We also intend to use 'H&S Lead' for the non-specialist in the workplaces (we have just over 400 nationwide) who will be trained to do the RAs and will also produce the returns and actually administer the SMs on the ground, my previous employer calls them H&S Links,
John
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Guest
|
Posted By J Knight
PS, Yes, I also object strongly to Officer for all the reasons stated here
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Guest
|
Posted By Hilary Charlton
My title is "Environmental, Health and Safety Advisor" in my capacity for all things EH&S.
I like a nice Bulgarian Merlot myself.
Hilary
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Guest
|
Posted By Ron Young
Group Safety Manager for all things safety, we also have a Group Health Manager who manages Occ. Health. We have regular meetings for the crossover issues and it works well.
A fine Margaux or Barolo
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Guest
|
Posted By Dave Richardson
I started out as a H&S Facilitator, part time.. Then I was promoted to full time and given the role of HS&E Officer. I am now H&S Specialist.
What's in a name Merlot, Chardinay, advisor, officer, specialist.... anything above 13% alcohol vol will do for me.
Merry Xmas
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Guest
|
Posted By John Mackessack
Dave
Anything above 13% is sherry isn't it?
Creme de Menthe anyone?
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Guest
|
Posted By J Knight
PPS Wine is good, though white is favoured currently over red. Pale Rider (beer, from Kelham Island brewery Sheffield) is a cracker, though since it has flavour it won't be to Oz tastes :)
John
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Guest
|
Posted By Tony Birchall
No-one's touched on the difference between "Adviser" and "Advisor"! Check the theasaurus. Mind you, you probably don't give a Four x do you?
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Guest
|
Posted By Rob T
Just about to come on to that point Tony. Adviser is American - Advisor is UK.
I have variously been Safety Officer (with local authority), H&S Advisor, H&S Manager and Safety, Health, Environment & Fire (SHEF) Team Leader.
Someone once told me that Officer meant you had the power to enforce matters whereas Advisor didn't. That may have been partly true in the old days (early nineties) but I don't think that applies in any way today.
I prefer a good South African Pinotage. Where's Bryn Maidment - I thought that as he is the most recent emigree to Oz (that regularly uses this site) would have piped up with some Oz/Welsh "so much hotter, better sheep" type stuff by now.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Guest
|
Posted By Ken Taylor
I'm quite happy with 'Health and Safety Officer'. I'm not regarded as managing all H&S or simply one of the management and also not seen as just an adviser/or (I thought 'er' was English and 'or' Latin). Then I predate 1974 and so may be old-fashioned in that respect.
We managed 7 degC on the Isle of Wight on Monday whilst those on the South East mainland tell me it was below zero - but perhaps they were exaggerating. We grow grapes and produce wine on the Island too and have been told that it's generally better than the French equivalent - if not the Australian version. I suppose this to be because they suffer from too much sun down there.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Guest
|
Posted By Jane Ling
I've been finding this an interesting debate. After 10 years as Admin Manager with health and safety as part of this role I have just been appointed to a full-time health and safety role in the organisation. Interestingly they have chosen the title Health and Safety Controller (and yes I've already had all the jokes) which I notice nobody has yet mentioned on this thread. Personally I would have preferred co-ordinator or adviser for all the previously mentioned reasons.
Jane
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Guest
|
Posted By Stuart Nagle
It is interesting to note in this discussion that the term 'Officer' as in 'Health and Safety Officer' has not been recognised as only being adopted into general employment, but originated in Local Government.
The term 'Officer' as in 'Local Government Officer' Arose to identify those who where paid a 'salary' above a certain 'spinal column point' in the local government pay scale structure and distinguished them from those who were tradesmen (on the tools), and which harks back many years to the days when the Borough Engineer was God and the Highways/Drainage/Waste etc Superintendants were next to God.
it is also interesting that in our supposed classless society, even the most left wing of local authorities appear not to have noticed this and overlooked
what can only be described a 'class distinction' based on the identity of those who obeyed orders and those who gave them... The 'Officers'
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Guest
|
Posted By Ken Taylor
If we also term the Human Resources Officers, Finance Officers, etc, etc as advisers/ors to whom will the advice be given and who will issue instructions for its implementation? I suppose this will be the 'managers' - but wait a minute, isn't that term even more 'class-ridden'. Perhaps, then, we should all just advise each other and let everyone decide whether to take the advice or not?
Perhaps it will be safer to just consider 'officer' as someone who has an office in which to work?
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Guest
|
Posted By Gary Hallett
I've just read with interest the responses, within our company dependant who you speak to I'm refered to as that anoying pom(m),
rooi-nek the safety guy/ officer/ manager/ adviser/or - I am based in Dubai had christmas lunch out side coldest it been was early in the Morning 19c.Quiet fond of the Old Jacobs Creek preferably red.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Guest
|
Posted By garyh
You poor saps. Employers often give people in SH&E fancy titles designed to inflate the ego, whilst dumping any non glamarous responsibilities on them at the same time. So instead of a decent PROFESSIONAL Salary we tend to accept rates a good tradesperson can get, but then again a fancy title is such good compensation!
The bottom line is, YOUR TITLE DOESN'T MATTER. What you are paid does.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Guest
|
Posted By Ken Taylor
I'd have to say, Gary, that, once you've sorted out the salary, it's also worth having a title with some credibility and a position in the organisation that enables you to exercise some influence. I still remember the advert for a Safety Officer/ Car Park Attendant!
|
|
|
|
|
|
IOSH forums home
»
Our public forums
»
OSH discussion forum
»
Safety People, titles and their professional use
You cannot post new topics in this forum.
You cannot reply to topics in this forum.
You cannot delete your posts in this forum.
You cannot edit your posts in this forum.
You cannot create polls in this forum.
You cannot vote in polls in this forum.