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#1 Posted : 20 October 2009 15:23:00(UTC)
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Posted By Mark1983 I was under the impression that to use a ladder safely one must maintain 3 points of contact with the ladder at all times... http://www.hse.gov.uk/pubns/indg402.pdf Near the bottom of the above article however it shows a picture of a man replacing a lightbulb with a green tick next to it - but both his hands are off the ladder - can someone plse explain Thanks
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#2 Posted : 20 October 2009 15:35:00(UTC)
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Posted By Barrie (Badger) Etter Mark In the first part someone has made a gaff. On the second IMHO basically the guidence ladder work should only be for short duration work, so changing a light bulb would fall into this catagory and not normally that far off the ground. Badger
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#3 Posted : 20 October 2009 16:08:00(UTC)
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Posted By Rob W I recall being told by the HSE that the body leaning against the steps is counted as a third point of contact. quote from http://www.hse.gov.uk/fa...tepladderthreepoints.htm "Three points of contact can mean two feet and one hand, two feet and the body supported by a “D-ring” as show in the illustration, or two feet and the body supported by the stepladder."
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#4 Posted : 20 October 2009 16:19:00(UTC)
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Posted By Raymond Rapp For what it is worth, I think 3 points of contact is suitable for a ladder, but not necessary for a step ladder, which is designed to be worked from as opposed to a ladder which is for access. Common sense goes a long way in this game. Ray
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#5 Posted : 21 October 2009 08:50:00(UTC)
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Posted By Crim A HSE Inspector recently told me that ladders are not banned, however they would prefer to see work from "Pop Ups" instead.
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#6 Posted : 21 October 2009 09:05:00(UTC)
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Posted By Mark1983 Pop ups ????
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#7 Posted : 21 October 2009 09:12:00(UTC)
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Posted By A Campbell Mark, A piece of access equipment for light work... http://www.abcpopupsltd.co.uk/Live/popup.php
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#8 Posted : 21 October 2009 09:32:00(UTC)
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Posted By Mark1983 Ridiculous, an electricians not going to use one of those every time he goes to change a light bulb, don't you think the industry is taking this too far?
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#9 Posted : 21 October 2009 10:21:00(UTC)
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Posted By A Campbell I had this question when working with a FM company. It's a matter of weighing up the job. If changing 1 or 2 lightbulbs, then fine stepladders, combination ladders etc would likely be suitable for a short duration task. If it was for multiple use, e.g a whole change out for a shop floor then alternative equipment would have to be considered.
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#10 Posted : 21 October 2009 12:27:00(UTC)
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Posted By Clark Kent I stand on a chair to change a light bulb.
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#11 Posted : 21 October 2009 12:55:00(UTC)
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Posted By Cliff Davis Surely not Clark, i thought you would fly up there wearing your underpants outside your trousers!!!!.
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#12 Posted : 21 October 2009 13:36:00(UTC)
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Posted By Paul Timms Direct from the WAH regulations 10. Every ladder shall be used in such a way that - (a) a secure handhold and secure support are always available to the user; and (b) the user can maintain a safe handhold when carrying a load unless, in the case of a step ladder, the maintenance of a handhold is not practicable when a load is carried, and a risk assessment under regulation 3 of the Management Regulations has demonstrated that the use of a stepladder is justified because of - (i) the low risk; and (ii) the short duration of use.
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#13 Posted : 21 October 2009 16:35:00(UTC)
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Posted By Crim I have just returned from a site inspection in Melton Mowbray, visited by HSE inspector last week who told the site manager step ladders were not recommended on site, he would rather see work caried out from MEWP's. Two step ladders still on site, one damaged to be removed from site today.
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#14 Posted : 21 October 2009 16:41:00(UTC)
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Posted By Raymond Rapp The best and safest WAH equipment should be used for the job. however, in the real world practicalities dictate what can and can't be used. We insist that towers or podiums are used unless due to constraints such as a space it is not practicable, then ladders or step ladders can be used. Simples.
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#15 Posted : 21 October 2009 17:07:00(UTC)
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Posted By clairel For a start podiums are not without risk and there has been an increase in podium related accidents due to so many people switching to them thinking they are inherently 'safe'. They are not. Just as MEWP's are not inherently safe. You trade one risk for another based on the situation and which may be perceived to be a safer alterntaive. I am shocked that two people above have mentioned that HSE inspectors are suggesting that they would rather not see ladders being used but alternatives. That is not the party line (so to speak). The HSE are at pains to say that ladders can be used in appropriate circumstances. Just goes to show that there are good and bad inspectors IMO. As to the original post I think you have misinterpreted the HSE's guidance doc. Perhaps the crosses on the pictures are misleading. INDG402 shows a man working on a stepladder, side on, with a drill. If you read carefully you will see that it is the side on working that is wrong. The picture below it shows the same activity but not side on and if you notice he is not holding on with his hands (as the previous post says the 3 points of contact is for ladder working). If a step ladder is the best tool for the job then continue to use it IMO.
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#16 Posted : 21 October 2009 17:21:00(UTC)
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Posted By clairel Sorry, should have also said that the two pictures you are referring to are not about 3 points of contact but about how many rungs are free at the top of the stepladder.
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#17 Posted : 22 October 2009 11:38:00(UTC)
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Posted By Cliff Davis Hierarchy of equipment selection dictates what is used, which should form part of the risk assessment surely. A wide open floor on a construction site dictates that a mobile tower should be used, where as working in the ceiling void of a small cupboard or toilet would mean the equipment selected would probably be steps. Its all down to the risk assessment.
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