Rank: New forum user
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Hello
I'd appreciate your professional opinions on this.
How have you managed who the 'Responsible Person' is in your companies, particularly in relation to Fire?
We've had a recent Fire Officer visit ....
Thanks for your help, Stephanie
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Rank: Super forum user
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Stephanie
Before the technical answers start on this is my view.
It depends on who controls the purse strings, which controls the manpower, who controls the budgets for the area.
The HS Advisor cannot be that person.
Engineers and managers spend money but do not necessarily decide everything it is spent on. The more senior managers that the engineers and managers work for are responsible for,as they are the one that are responsible for ensuring that the resources are spent appropriately. They have sufficient authority.
They are the responsible person
Steve
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Rank: Super forum user
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Our responsible person is the CEO; it's on our fire organogram. The Head of Estates is listed as the Fire Safety Manager for the organisation, and in practice he takes all the decisions on expenditure supported by his boss, the Director of Property,
John
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Rank: Super forum user
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"Responsible Person" has a specific meaning under Article 3 (a) of the FSO. In a workplace RP = employer, so it is actually most likely to be the body corporate not an individual.
The person who you appoint to be responsible for carrying out the requirements of the FSO is not necessarily the RP in law.
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Rank: New forum user
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Hi Stephanie,
By definition, the 'Responsible person' is the person that owns the premises or business, or the person with control over the premises, business or activity.
As Heather pointed out, the RRFSO requires that the ‘responsible’ person carries out a fire risk assessment, though in practice this is often delegated to a 'competent person', who must have sufficient training experience and knowledge to carry out the fire risk assessment.
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Rank: New forum user
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Thanks to you all. You have confirmed my understanding.
Much appreciated, Stephanie
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Rank: Super forum user
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Stepanie
A 'responsible person' is used ubiquitously within organisations both formally and informally. Anyone could be deemed or appointed a responsible person, depending on the task and their competence for that task. Normally it is applied to a 'responsible manager' denoting a certain level of authority as well as competence. For formal appointments a letter or some other form of authority should be provided by a more senior person.
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Rank: Super forum user
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Responsible person duties and responsibilities cannot be passed on by delegation.
The RP is still the person who owns the premises or business, or the employer.
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Rank: New forum user
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Agree with Chris. With regards to the RRFSO, the responsible person remains the person that owns the premises or business, or the person with control over the premises, business or activity and cannot be delegated.
He can appoint a 'competent' person to carry out the donkey work, but is still the 'responsible' person.
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Rank: Forum user
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Sorry if this matter has been well discussed before but I remain concerned that many who post here do not understand the concept of a “legal person”. Heather touches on it in her post above but has everyone got their heads around it?
When the fire safety legislation refers to a person it means a “legal person”. This can be a single individual but in most cases it is going to be the company or organisation which employs staff and/or which occupies the premises. The law allows these corporate entities to act as though they were single individuals or persons but let’s not forgot that actually they are not – it is just a legal convenience. So when the fire safety legislation places duties and responsibilities on the responsible person you do not have to go looking around to find an individual on the staff who is going to take on this role. The company which employs you is already that person in the sense that it is a “legal person”. So whenever legislation refers to a person you need to ask yourself if, in your particular circumstances, it does mean a single individual or does it mean the corporate entity – i.e. the company which employs you.
Almost all of the posts which are suggesting that the responsible person needs to be a single individual (e.g. the Managing Director) appear to have missed this very important point.
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Rank: Super forum user
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Hi Al,
I am well aware of the exsitence in law of 'legal persons' and I am also aware that 'responsible person' could be taken to mean such a legal entity, and doesn't necessarily have to be a real meat person. However, in the context of the question, it is worth pointing out that for internal purposes it is helpful to make somebody personally responsible for fire safety. That person does need to have the power to marshall the resources of the legal person, in short that person needs to be able to fulifill the criteria of a controlling mind. The OP seemed to imply that such a controllng mind is what their fire officer was looking for,
John
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