Hello, today I have been asked by one of my friends about the heights of ballustrades and guardrails in Church(es).

I came accross values such as 1100mm and our favouride 950mm (in absence of any other standards).

Did you have any previous experiences working in Church/Choir areas?

Thank you in advance and stay safe.

Regards!

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/protection-from-falling-collision-and-impact-approved-document-k 

For England Approved Document K is the necessary reference.

Application of the content is not retrospective meaning the age of the church will have some bearing upon what was acceptable at time of build compared to what would need to be changed in the event of refurbishment

Captcha JCRX

Hi Carl

The church' insurers will have a view on this and probably demand quinquennial building surveys.

I would be as concerned about the structural condition of the edge protection as much as its height.

Originally Posted by: Kate

But weren't many churches built many hundreds of years ago, and most of them before Building Regs even existed?

Exactly.  I don't think I've ever seen a church with a balcony / mezzanine in the 'main space' (whatever that denomination calls it) that meets modern standards.  Some of them are only slightly above knee height - they've been designed so that people sitting in the pews can see over the rail.  Steeply raked balconies and low edge protection is not uncommon.

(I do note that I haven't been in a church designed this century, though).

I'd reiterate talk to the insurer, though the last church insurer I dealt with was not great - they wanted the church to adopt a hot works policy (fair enough) and offered a document that was supposedly their church-specific guidance and it talked about isolating production processes and removing flammable / explosive gas cylinders.  Looked very cribbed from a general industrial one to me...    

"Paddy's Wigwam" aka Liverpool Metropolitan Cathedral is a very modernistic design especially in comparison to the Anglican cathedral commenced some sixty years prior and completed some eleven years later.

Originally Posted by: knotty

I would focus more on visitor safety than the legal position under building regs. 

Now I am curious. What references would you use for visitor safety?

As with TLA's need to be cautious with names - I am going to presume you mean the Purple Guide

https://www.thepurpleguide.co.uk/ 

rather than the Purple Book which dependent upon industry and context can have many different meanings

https://www.ppf.co.uk/purple-book

https://www.fda.gov/drugs/therapeutic-biologics-applications-bla/purple-book-lists-licensed-biological-products-reference-product-exclusivity-and-biosimilarity-or

https://www.rcpch.ac.uk/shop-publications/physical-signs-child-sexual-abuse-evidence-based-review

or for my background the UN Globally Harmonised System "Purple Book"

I am not sure that the Purple Guide is that helpful as it was drafted mostly for things happening outdoors.

I had thought about referencing what has been published by what used to be the Visitor Safety in the Countryside Group for free, but like the Purple Guide what has been published by the successor body to VSCG is something you have to buy.

In terms of the judgments on the marginally different Occupier's Liability Acts that apply to England & Wales or Scotland, these are discussed here:

Guide to public safety on flood and coastal risk management sites - GOV.UK (www.gov.uk)

But, again this looks at scenarios out in the open air, as does ALL the case law.

So, I think in terms of the height of edge protection you are back to the Approved Document already mentioned by Roundtuit but with regard to the "grandfather rights" that apply to older buildings AND noting that in historic structures (more so if Listed) even if doing a refurbishment, if all the intricate railings that might be in an old church were of a height lower than would now be expected, it is unlikely that any Planning Department would be supportive of any proposal that would suddenly result in a mishmash of different height railings.

All about that delicate balance between public safety and an approach that is sympathetic to the architectural heritage, and there are other solutions such as have been mentioned on this thread.