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J Sullivan  
#1 Posted : 10 June 2022 10:45:45(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
J Sullivan

Safeguarding training advice please

Is it a legal requirement to have someone trained with in a private Ltd organisation if the following applies   

  • Work experience placements with in an engineering environment less than 5 placements year (usually 1 week – 4 weeks )
  • Apprentices, young workers who have left school ,under the age of 18 within an engineering environment (4 year apprenticeship)

Note

H&S Policies and controls are established and in place , the control measures are co-ordinated via HR department – schools – parents in line with policy guidance

Just trying to establish our legal position for safeguarding training      

Thanks  john  

Kate  
#2 Posted : 10 June 2022 10:52:00(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Kate

I certainly hope not, as I've never come across such training being done in similar situations!

J Sullivan  
#3 Posted : 10 June 2022 11:34:51(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
J Sullivan

thanks for the reply , I was under the same impression also 

regards 

peter gotch  
#4 Posted : 11 June 2022 11:27:05(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
peter gotch

Hi JS - has somebody been trying to do a sales pitch?

HSE and both the UK and devolved Governments have tried to take steps to influence the avoidance of the "blue tape" of bureaucratic hurdles to work experience etc.

See e.g. https://education.gov.scot/media/qmzpnz5d/work-placement-toolkit.pdf 

P

chris42  
#5 Posted : 13 June 2022 07:54:40(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
chris42

Originally Posted by: J Sullivan Go to Quoted Post

 

  • Work experience placements with in an engineering environment less than 5 placements year (usually 1 week – 4 weeks )      

Are you asking in this part regarding a "Child" doing the work experience ? Where in the second part to mention "Young Person".

Peters Guidance seemed to be about young persons only.

Edited by user 13 June 2022 07:58:03(UTC)  | Reason: Seemed to have problems with the word young

Pirellipete  
#6 Posted : 13 June 2022 09:02:17(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Pirellipete

Isn't 'Safeguarding' more applicable to care/health giving/Vulnerable people At Risk scenarios ??

As I understand it, a child is under 16, a young person is 16-18 and then you're an adult

RA's are generally adequate for site visits and placements, and there is guidance ont he HSE website for Young Persons.

You're more likely to get push-back from your company insurers tbh, depending on the workplace activities

J Sullivan  
#7 Posted : 13 June 2022 10:02:24(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
J Sullivan

The reason for me asking this question on one of our polices its says 

Safeguarding For Work Experience Placements POLICY 

Designated Child Protection Person  The HR department has received Safeguarding Training and has Designated Child Protection responsibilities.

During an audit of the policy i noted this as an observation in the corrective actions report . I dont  beleive its a leagl requirment. 

Brian Hagyard  
#8 Posted : 13 June 2022 10:47:48(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Brian Hagyard

Originally Posted by: J Sullivan Go to Quoted Post

The reason for me asking this question on one of our polices its says 

Safeguarding For Work Experience Placements POLICY 

Designated Child Protection Person  The HR department has received Safeguarding Training and has Designated Child Protection responsibilities.

During an audit of the policy i noted this as an observation in the corrective actions report . I dont  beleive its a leagl requirment. 

I have notted the apprentice suppliers (hope thats the right term) are asking for this - not a problem for us because of teh work we do - but its not a H&S requirement. But like any club if you want to join you have to abide by their rules!

I have also noticed they are asking for things like the number of fire escapes we have! (not easy in a multy building site!) and one got upset with me when they asked which the apprentice would use and i said "nearest" !

peter gotch  
#9 Posted : 13 June 2022 16:03:58(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
peter gotch

Ah, Brian - no help to the "auditor"!!

If you have X buildings with say 20 final exit points and you say that the apprentice will use the "nearest" one, if they decide to do a site visit as part of their "audit" they are going to have to check ALL 20 final exit point AND the various routes to those 20.

"Auditors" do have a habit of asking questions which they might regret having been given the correct answer - in this case "nearest".

P

matelot1965  
#10 Posted : 13 June 2022 20:53:52(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
matelot1965

Having just completed safeguarding training today as a mandatory policy requirment for our organistion because we have apprentices. The NSPCC online course also deals with vulnerable adults The course was entitled safeguarding for 16-25 year old. 

Pirellipete  
#11 Posted : 14 June 2022 10:34:14(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Pirellipete

indg364, (Young People and Work Experience),  makes no reference to any Safeguarding Officer/Person for Apprentices or Work Placement of Young Persons or those below MLSA, (Minimum School Leaving Age), on a Work Placement

Neither does the HSE Website.........

Roundtuit  
#12 Posted : 14 June 2022 12:11:11(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Roundtuit

Probably because safeguarding itself is not directly within the remit of the HSE (just as Public Health issues should never have been)

https://www.gov.uk/topic/schools-colleges-childrens-services/safeguarding-children

thanks 6 users thanked Roundtuit for this useful post.
Brian Hagyard on 14/06/2022(UTC), A Kurdziel on 15/06/2022(UTC), peter gotch on 15/06/2022(UTC), Brian Hagyard on 14/06/2022(UTC), A Kurdziel on 15/06/2022(UTC), peter gotch on 15/06/2022(UTC)
Roundtuit  
#13 Posted : 14 June 2022 12:11:11(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Roundtuit

Probably because safeguarding itself is not directly within the remit of the HSE (just as Public Health issues should never have been)

https://www.gov.uk/topic/schools-colleges-childrens-services/safeguarding-children

thanks 6 users thanked Roundtuit for this useful post.
Brian Hagyard on 14/06/2022(UTC), A Kurdziel on 15/06/2022(UTC), peter gotch on 15/06/2022(UTC), Brian Hagyard on 14/06/2022(UTC), A Kurdziel on 15/06/2022(UTC), peter gotch on 15/06/2022(UTC)
Herb  
#14 Posted : 15 June 2022 19:02:14(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Herb

There is no requirement to have safeguarding training for work experience.

Brian Hagyard  
#15 Posted : 16 June 2022 08:21:54(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Brian Hagyard

Originally Posted by: Herb Go to Quoted Post

There is no requirement to have safeguarding training for work experience.

Sorry Herb but organisation makeing placements with us are asking for it or refusing the placement - so there is a requirement - but i if you mean there is no Legal Requirement under HASAW I would agree.

I think it was Groucho Marx that said he would not want to be a member of any club that would actualy let him join (or something like that). Sometimes you have to abide by someone elses rules if you want to play the game.

rs10  
#16 Posted : 21 June 2022 11:58:41(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
rs10

If you are still after further information you could also speak to your local safeguarding board / local authority who can identfy if your organisation is in the scope of the Childrens Act 2004 or any implications etc.  They also could put you in touch with your LADO (Local Authority Designated Officer).

In terms of specific training - various organisations available such as NSPCC, CPDonline, Hi-Speed or Barnados etc.  

Feel free to message if you need more info.

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