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julietpowell  
#1 Posted : 12 April 2018 18:11:55(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
julietpowell

Hi
i am looking into training a current employee to enable him to undertake all aspects of Work at Height (MEWPS, Fall Arrest Podiums etc) training in-house, does anybody know what course i need to look for?
he is a natural trainer and we have a large number of employees who require formal training so it makes sense to do it in-house if we can, but i want to do it correctly and ensure they receive the correct training so he needs to attend an accredited training course
thank you
juliet

Edited by user 12 April 2018 19:43:06(UTC)  | Reason: added

Bigmac1  
#2 Posted : 12 April 2018 19:05:03(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Bigmac1

Never ever use fall arrest with a MEWP, Please listen

julietpowell  
#3 Posted : 12 April 2018 19:26:41(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
julietpowell

no we dont use fall arrest with MEWPs, but we have a number of different processes which require different methods to undertake safe working at height (MEWPS, podiums, Fall Arrest etc) and obviously they all require full training and if one person can train for all methods this is the manner i want to go. 

i didnt appriciate your rude reply, i am not stupid so please dont patronise without knowing all the facts

Stuart Smiles  
#4 Posted : 12 April 2018 20:12:12(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Stuart Smiles

ipaf is recognised externally, in the north east, where I an, it can be done with tyne and wear access, on the ipaf website is a list of who are trainers.

they can do in house or full, Personally i believe full with certificates is better with tests etc, however some have the perception of once they've got certificates recognised elsewhere they'll leave...  

get all of the things onsite in a day so that you can use whatever's available from hire companies and relevant to your site. 

tickets last 5 years, but not recognised by citb as they have their own, but most recognise as appropriate. also do harness training at same time and potentially face fit testing if need be or arco for face fit. 

boigy77  
#5 Posted : 13 April 2018 09:22:25(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
boigy77

Originally Posted by: Bigmac1 Go to Quoted Post

Never ever use fall arrest with a MEWP, Please listen

Every single MEWP??

Hsquared14  
#6 Posted : 13 April 2018 12:00:51(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Hsquared14

Are some people confusing fall arrest with fall restraint?  Just askin'

I would endorse other people's comments regarding training providers though.

boblewis  
#7 Posted : 13 April 2018 12:47:28(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
boblewis

People able train for the aspects you listed are not necessarily found in a single organisation.  IPAF for instance covers powered access while PASMA is aimed at alloy towers etc.  A single day to train a trainer is not therefore a viable option - you will need to look at a series of courses from various providers

thanks 1 user thanked boblewis for this useful post.
julietpowell on 14/04/2018(UTC)
olufsen1  
#8 Posted : 13 April 2018 15:41:57(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
olufsen1

Originally Posted by: Bigmac1 Go to Quoted Post

Never ever use fall arrest with a MEWP, Please listen

Totally Agree.
Originally Posted by: boigy77 Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Bigmac1 Go to Quoted Post

Never ever use fall arrest with a MEWP, Please listen

Every single MEWP??

Tell me when fall arest needs using in a MEWP?

boblewis  
#9 Posted : 13 April 2018 18:31:34(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
boblewis

Fall arrest can  only be envisaged in a cherry picker where the potential for catapault situations occurrs.  This is however a situation where misuse is the root cause

Edited by user 13 April 2018 18:32:26(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

julietpowell  
#10 Posted : 14 April 2018 08:31:39(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
julietpowell

Originally Posted by: boblewis Go to Quoted Post

People able train for the aspects you listed are not necessarily found in a single organisation.  IPAF for instance covers powered access while PASMA is aimed at alloy towers etc.  A single day to train a trainer is not therefore a viable option - you will need to look at a series of courses from various providers

Thanks Boblewis, Yes  i knew that he would have to attend seperate courses but i was hoping i could use just the one provider to offer all but ive found thats not the case :-( 

we are going to train by priority, MEWP 1st as we have more employees that requiring training for these then move down the list with the other courses.

Bigmac1  
#11 Posted : 14 April 2018 10:08:24(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Bigmac1

Originally Posted by: julietpowell Go to Quoted Post

no we dont use fall arrest with MEWPs, but we have a number of different processes which require different methods to undertake safe working at height (MEWPS, podiums, Fall Arrest etc) and obviously they all require full training and if one person can train for all methods this is the manner i want to go. 

i didnt appriciate your rude reply, i am not stupid so please dont patronise without knowing all the facts

It wasnt rude, read the title of your post please.

I just thought that you wernt competent and were asking for advice!!!

Bigmac1  
#12 Posted : 14 April 2018 10:15:03(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Bigmac1

Originally Posted by: boigy77 Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Bigmac1 Go to Quoted Post

Never ever use fall arrest with a MEWP, Please listen

Every single MEWP??

Why would you wanna arrest fall, when you can stop a fall?

The forces of a fall can pull a MEWP over, then whats the consequence?

Boom type MEPS only ever wear fall restraint, Scissors dont necesarily come with anchor points so you cant clip on.

boigy77  
#13 Posted : 14 April 2018 11:15:10(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
boigy77

Originally Posted by: Bigmac1 Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: boigy77 Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Bigmac1 Go to Quoted Post

Never ever use fall arrest with a MEWP, Please listen

Every single MEWP??

Why would you wanna arrest fall, when you can stop a fall?

The forces of a fall can pull a MEWP over, then whats the consequence?

Boom type MEPS only ever wear fall restraint, Scissors dont necesarily come with anchor points so you cant clip on.

My mistake, I was reading too quickly, point taken.

julietpowell  
#14 Posted : 23 April 2018 18:18:13(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
julietpowell

i have been contacted by a training company today regarding my query (train an employee to become an instructor) and received this as a reply

'You could  go for what is used on sites i.e. Site Safety Plus courses, each team has a supervisor and there is a nice course SSSTS (Site Supervisor Safety Training Scheme) which is two days (can be over two weeks, on Saturdays etc) where the delegates get trained to deliver tool-box talks so getting every member of staff with recorded training. The courses are HSE recognised and the five day SMSTS (site management) has been around for 40 years now and SSSTS for the last 20.'

if the employee gained the SSSTS qualification, would any training he delivered (especially MEWP training) ensure full compliance with legislation?

boblewis  
#15 Posted : 24 April 2018 13:28:38(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
boblewis

Short answer is NO

The SSSTS and SMSTS courses are about, primarily, site management and supervisory competence and are recognised by the HSE for that purpose.

DaveBridle  
#16 Posted : 24 April 2018 13:51:08(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
DaveBridle

As bob says the SSSTS and SMSTS will not help you in this instance. It sounds like you need a Train-the-Trainer course.  However I would expect this to be costly for what you need.  I would approach a training company and ask them for a price on delivering the courses you require and having it conducted "in-House" i.e. they come to you and your employees are the only delegates.

If you are able to get an employee trained to deliver the courses they would then have to be externally monitored by the relevant organisations such as IPAF etc. so that they can verify that the course content and its delivery meets their standards and then the instructor is competent to issue certification in their name.

Your desired route, i doubt will be availabe via a training provider as they will look upon it as potentially taking away business from them so will be expensive, hence my option for an external trainer coming to you to deliver a package of courses.

best of luck

thanks 1 user thanked DaveBridle for this useful post.
lorna on 25/04/2018(UTC)
Charlie Brown  
#17 Posted : 24 April 2018 18:29:11(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Charlie Brown

Sorry, been in Australia for the past 3 weeks so not seen this but please indulge me regarding the original question.

Honestly, I wouldn't be bothering with in-house options for WAH

Regarding MEWPs, If it was me I would insist upon the operators being IPAF trained. If you want your guy to be trained to run IPAF courses then this will be a process that includes training, peer review and examination as well as ongoing monitoring, all of which in my view are essentials. Not really worth it unless you have hundreds of employees needing to use MEWPs.

Ditto regarding towers and podiums. While PASMA certified courses are comprehensive and inexpensive.

The use of external providers also ensures unbiased and independent training.

Also, boblewis is right, a fall arrest lanyard attached to a full body harness is what is needed when operating MEWPs as it prevents the operator being thrown from the cage of the machine.

Kate  
#18 Posted : 24 April 2018 18:52:37(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Kate

Charlie Brown - don't you mean a restraint lanyard?

GJW  
#19 Posted : 24 April 2018 20:34:57(UTC)
Rank: New forum user
GJW

Originally Posted by: julietpowell Go to Quoted Post

Hi
i am looking into training a current employee to enable him to undertake all aspects of Work at Height (MEWPS, Fall Arrest Podiums etc) training in-house, does anybody know what course i need to look for?
he is a natural trainer and we have a large number of employees who require formal training so it makes sense to do it in-house if we can, but i want to do it correctly and ensure they receive the correct training so he needs to attend an accredited training course
thank you
juliet

Hi Juliet,

I looked into this issue several months ago and got in touch with IPAF, but it was going to be a costly activity. The potential trainer required to do several courses hold a PTTLS qualification and then our organisation would have to become a member of IPAF and pay an anual fee to be a registerd company. Therefore, I decided just to use an independent body, which catered for our needs. MEWPS 3a/3b etc ticket lasts for five years, so decided against using our in-house training. If you google IPAF and talk it through with them, you will see where I am coming from. Best of luck Juliet.

PS Ignore some of the blunt rude comments and carrying on doing the good work!

Kind regards Gary

Charlie Brown  
#20 Posted : 25 April 2018 20:09:35(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Charlie Brown

DOH!!!! I did it again which makes it twice within a couple of months.

Yes indeed Kate I do in fact mean restraint lanyard, thanks.

In fact a fall ARREST lanyard should NEVER be used in a MEWP as the operator should never be in the position where they are able to be thrown out of the basket and left hanging which is the point of wearing a harness and suitably adjusted restraint lanyard.

Originally Posted by: Kate Go to Quoted Post

Charlie Brown - don't you mean a restraint lanyard?

Edited by user 25 April 2018 20:18:34(UTC)  | Reason: thick fingers

fscott  
#21 Posted : 30 April 2018 10:06:58(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
fscott

You might want to have a look at NPORS (https://www.npors.com/) as they cover a huge range of plant including MEWPS, Scaffolds, Harnesses etc.  It won't be cheap to get your guy trained as a recognised instructor accross all these categories but NPORS may allow you to do it under one umbrella organisation rather than jumping between IPAF, PASMA etc.urZv

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